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Poland and why in the past it was so many times attacked

posts: 16

	jess90us [Guest]
	Edited by: jess90us Mar 19, 07, 12:13 #1 In history, we hear about Poland being attacked so much. Well, my friends always laugh at me cause I jokingly get offended. Well, one of them said cause Poland was so easy to take over. Well, I retorted with, "No, it's not that Poland was easy to take over, but the fact that Poland is such a desirable plot in the world." Poland was just too happy (like moi) to put in a full fledged fight. Then, they let by gones be by gones. Well, one of these days, a country will mess with Poland one too many times, and then Poland will SNAP and go ballistic on the rest of the world, and TAKE OVER!!! Then return the world and show that no one should mess with Poland. Just one of my mindless ramblings (I have many.) I want to hear your take on this. Anybody.	Guest

	Pawelek
	Mar 19, 07, 13:56 #2 The lack of natural borders doesn't help. Combine this with the fact that Russia and Germany are two neighbors with larger populations who have historically considered Polish territory to be a necessary, or at least desirable, buffer against each other. Voila!	Member Posts: 12 Joined: Jan 25, 07

	LoneStranger
	Mar 19, 07, 14:28 #3 Quoting: jess90us Poland and why in the past it was so many times attacked So that we can discuss about them today!	Member Posts: 666 Joined: Jan 30, 07

	ArturSzastak
	Mar 19, 07, 14:34 #4 Quoting: LoneStranger So that we can discuss about them today! Becuase we are dead center in the middle of Europe. In the past trades were done by large caravans, so they passed through Poland and Hungary a lot. Asian silks were brought to Middle East, shipped to Kiev (which Poland once owned) or sent off towards Hungary, and then the rest of Europe. That is if they didn't go through Italy. And historically, Slavs had many wars against each other, trying to make one slavic kingdom so that they can then expand and what not. Too many reasons really	Member Posts: 1057 Joined: Feb 16, 07

	LoneStranger
	Mar 19, 07, 14:40 #5 Quoting: ArturSzastak Too many reasons really Childhood of humanity	Member Posts: 666 Joined: Jan 30, 07

	ArturSzastak
	Mar 19, 07, 14:41 #6 Quoting: LoneStranger Childhood of humanity ???? Can you exprain to me? Prease? Exprain fo me? Prease?	Member Posts: 1057 Joined: Feb 16, 07

	Matyjasz
	Mar 19, 07, 14:58 #7 Because of German "drang nach osten" and because we were a part of eastern gate to Europe. PS: Quoting: jess90us In history, we hear about Poland being attacked so much. Well, my friends always laugh at me cause I jokingly get offended. Well, one of them said cause Poland was so easy to take over. If it would have been so easy we would share the fate of other Slavic tribes that settled west from Oder river. Instead, Poland not only stopped the German "drang nach osten" in the XI century, but even managed to acquire a strong political position from XIV to XVII century. Taking into consideration that we were basically surrounded by such nations like Germans, Turks, Swedes, Mongols/Tartars and Russians, that’s not bad innit?	Member Posts: 1456 Joined: Jul 20, 06

	LoneStranger
	Mar 19, 07, 14:59 #8 I believe that humanity has developed alot throughour evolution. The dark ages and middle ages were humanities childhood. Those times have seen many worse immoral and violent acts, and they were much frequent. It was a part of society at that time, a part of law. Now is different. Talk about women rights, children rights, medication, all the human rights, our intention to discuss (or atleast the pressure), our constant tries towards a more stronger international community and voice. Our rapid integration between people from all corners of humanity. Etc etc etc... Although we still have wars now... but these are not as easy to start as it was perhaps even a thousand years ago. I dont say that making have matured...but atleast we are in our early teens now . Today is better than Yesterday, and Tommorow will always be better than today. Because tommorow will bring us close to a better understanding, and a more enlightened future . There can be a book written over this subject of human weaknesses, and the constant try of the superior human nature to grow further (and its constant successes throughout time). I hope you get my point here.	Member Posts: 666 Joined: Jan 30, 07

	clunkshift
	Mar 19, 07, 15:41 #9 Obviously inviting foreigners to be head of state is a poor tactic for maintaining independance. (in times past, i.e pre 20th century)	Member Posts: 104 Joined: Feb 6, 07

	ArturSzastak
	Mar 19, 07, 15:56 #10 Quoting: LoneStranger I believe that humanity has developed alot throughour evolution. The dark ages and middle ages were humanities childhood. Those times have seen many worse immoral and violent acts, and they were much frequent. It was a part of society at that time, a part of law. Now is different. Talk about women rights, children rights, medication, all the human rights, our intention to discuss (or atleast the pressure), our constant tries towards a more stronger international community and voice. Our rapid integration between people from all corners of humanity. Etc etc etc... Although we still have wars now... but these are not as easy to start as it was perhaps even a thousand years ago. I dont say that making have matured...but atleast we are in our early teens now . Today is better than Yesterday, and Tommorow will always be better than today. Because tommorow will bring us close to a better understanding, and a more enlightened future . There can be a book written over this subject of human weaknesses, and the constant try of the superior human nature to grow further (and its constant successes throughout time). I hope you get my point here. Ahh. I gotcha now	Member Posts: 1057 Joined: Feb 16, 07

	Matyjasz
	Mar 25, 07, 14:24 #11 Quoting: clunkshift Obviously inviting foreigners to be head of state is a poor tactic for maintaining independance. (in times past, i.e pre 20th century) What exactly do you have in mind? Electing Jegieło and Batory was a pretty good decision. (Although I agree that offering Polish crown to Wasa's was a mistake. )	Member Posts: 1456 Joined: Jul 20, 06

	clunkshift
	Mar 25, 07, 15:26 #12 Well, Henri de Valois was a dead loss who skipped back to France as soon as possible. Stefan Batory was a soldier and was OK for beating Ivan of Russia, but did bring in conscription and Cossacks. Bringing in the Swedish Wasa's resulted in Baltic wars, land losses and more migrations. (Please don't take this as anti-semetic, but the only people who thrived in 16th century Poland were the incoming jews, whose continued presence was arguably the critical factor in Poland's fate during the 20th century). Later, bringing in the German, Frederick Augustus, re-ignited the old Swedish problems and weakend Poland so that there was no way to avoid the Prussian/Russian/Austrian carve-up. So yes, I think that bringing in foreigners to run the country has been a disaster. You can count me as a republican living under a monarchy...	Member Posts: 104 Joined: Feb 6, 07

	ny multi -medi [Guest]
	Mar 30, 07, 20:56 #13 I am one of those people that must have had the "head" in the sand like the bird. All I ask is why... why would humans treat other humans as badly as what I have been told has been done. I have seen pictures on the net I would never have thought of and have read sotries that are just awful. I look at the bible and think what, destroy people because God said it was OK to do so.? What is wrong with us as a people that we are able to "hurt" others as has been done. Nancy	Guest

	ArturSzastak
	Mar 30, 07, 21:04 #14 Quoting: ny multi -medi I am one of those people that must have had the "head" in the sand like the bird. All I ask is why... why would humans treat other humans as badly as what I have been told has been done. I have seen pictures on the net I would never have thought of and have read sotries that are just awful. I look at the bible and think what, destroy people because God said it was OK to do so.? What is wrong with us as a people that we are able to "hurt" others as has been done. It's human nature. In all of human kinds history, there has been fighting, death, and survival of the fittest. How many groups of people have come and gone trying to survive? Too many. Violence will never end, we are animals and animals are naturally violent, given the right circumstances.	Member Posts: 1057 Joined: Feb 16, 07

	Patrycja19
	Mar 30, 07, 21:22 #15 Quoting: jess90us In history, we hear about Poland being attacked so much. Well, my friends always laugh at me cause I jokingly get offended. Well, one of them said cause Poland was so easy to take over. Well, I retorted with, "No, it's not that Poland was easy to take over, but the fact that Poland is such a desirable plot in the world." Poland was just too happy (like moi) to put in a full fledged fight. Then, they let by gones be by gones. Well, one of these days, a country will mess with Poland one too many times, and then Poland will SNAP and go ballistic on the rest of the world, and TAKE OVER!!! Then return the world and show that no one should mess with Poland. Just one of my mindless ramblings (I have many.) I want to hear your take on this. Anybody Well. Poland was flourishing with educated people, and some didnt like this one thing I can say, when my grandfather came to the united states he had education as a pharmacists. which back then was very big deal and because they didnt recognize his education here, he became bitter and had to take a labor job . as we all know, in order to stop a nation you have to go for the educated and well respected known politicians etc. when a country becomes strong and is a threat, this provokes others to up their forces. back then it was like a competition to which one man took it further and decided he wanted to be the power of europe. Poland is always been peaceful nation and I dont see then becoming ballistic. but I do see them not taking any more Sh*t if thats what you mean. I think the ball is in their court now and no one will be trying to "mess" with Poland again IMHO	Member Posts: 2867 Joined: Oct 31, 06

	Matyjasz
	Apr 1, 07, 07:13 #16 Quoting: clunkshift Well, Henri de Valois was a dead loss who skipped back to France as soon as possible. Stefan Batory was a soldier and was OK for beating Ivan of Russia, but did bring in conscription and Cossacks. Bringing in the Swedish Wasa's resulted in Baltic wars, land losses and more migrations. Henri de Valois was too short here to make any impact, be it positive or negative. Stefan Batory did bring in Cossacks, but I don't understand what it has to do with him being a foreigner. Bringing a foreigner to run the country doesn't automatically have to be a bad idea. As a Briton I’m sure you are more than aware of it. Jagieło was an outsider and yet started the so called "golden age" in polish history. Choosing Batory was also a good idea. The problem wasn’t choosing a foreigner, but choosing a foreigner that treated polish nation as a way to capture his motherlands crown, which was the case with Wasa's.	Member Posts: 1456 Joined: Jul 20, 06

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