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Do Poles get confused over the different word endings?


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posts: 51
Marek
  Mar 26, 07, 14:44  #31

Czesc, Stevie!

Boze mój, jestem zdumiony!! Twój polski jest niezle.

".......za (nie: dla) pomóc. Ona (nie: Ono) jest bardzo stara (nie: stary)
Para poprawien.
Inaczy jest dobrze.
Marek

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Michal
  Mar 26, 07, 15:16  #32

The book by Alexander Schenker is a very good book with lots of good grammatical examples but yes, it is rather dated now. I think he wrote it around 1966-I have a copy at home with the tapes. He wrote it in the USA after giving lessons to students and he based the course around his lessons. You should be able to pick up a dictionary somewhere though, try a second hand book shop. When you write 'mam niejedno slownik', does that mean that you have one or not? Do not worry about your errors, I make them all the time-even in English and at the end of the day-so what? If you can write in Polish and someone can understand then that is all that can be expected of you. Writing in Polish is not going to increase your life expectancy by fifteen or twenty years so what the heck.

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Stevie
  Mar 26, 07, 19:23  #33

Thanks Marek
Haha...I didn't even think about the ona vs. ono. All I wanted to do was specify that the BOOK was old, and not necessarily Mr. Alexander :P Although, logically speaking, one would assume a correlation....
So you're saying I don't need to put "dla" in the first sentence. So noted
::writes it down::

Michal
With mam niejedno slownik, I was trying to say more than one. I got that phrase from my online dictionary --> polish.slavic.pitt.edu/dictionary.pdf which I rely on quite often. I'm always looking for other sources though. Never thought of a second hand book shop. I'll remember that. Thanks

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Marek
Edited by: Marek  Mar 27, 07, 07:28  #34

Stevie!

"Dla" in Polish doesn't mean "for" in the English collocation "Thanks FOR the gift....", but rather in the sense of "Ta ksiazka jest DLA ciebie." (This book is FOR you.) In Polish, whenever you want to say "Thanks FOR something..", use "ZA" only! "Slicznie dziekuje ZA mile zaproszenie dzis wieczór!" (Thank you so much FOR your lovely invitation this evening!)

Trust this clears things up a bit. (As far as Pan Schenker's concerned, even old grammars can be useful in terms of the basics, though clearly not in terms of style, idiom or contemporary usage.) Again, I'd go with Dana Bielec "Polish Reference Grammar" Routledge, plus ancillary exercise books. By the by, I miswrote "para" (steamship), in terms of "a pair" or "a few of", it's "pare" or some form of "kilka"!
Marek

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Michal
  Mar 27, 07, 08:56  #35

I think that it should read dzis wieczorem. I have not seen dzis wieczor written like that but then again, I am not always right as has been shown on several occas.sions! Normally the time of day is in the instrumental case and not like the example above though.

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Michal
  Mar 27, 07, 09:01  #36

Also it would be right to say ty mowisz nie zle po polsku-I am not sure if the above example is good Polish or not. Twoja znajomosc jezyka polskiego jest dobra would be better I hope. Is there a word in Polish inaczy? Inaczej wszysko jest w porzadku, or wszysko jest dobre. You will need to go through a grammar book and check it all out. I am no expert but some of your examples do look a little 'sus' to me.

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Michal
  Mar 27, 07, 09:04  #37

Ja mam kilka slownikow ja mam wiecej niz jeden slownik seems more logical to me but then again get a true Pole to look through our work first.

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Marek
Edited by: Marek  Mar 27, 07, 10:22  #38

Michal,

Thanks! You may well be right about "Dzis wieczorem". As far as "znajomosci", foolish me, I should have remembered that in most languages it's not "the language", but, the"skill/knowledge" of the language, just as in German (the language I tend to revert back to, as it were): " Deine Polnischkenntnisse sind nicht schlecht." = Your Polish (read lit., ".....knowledges of Polish are...." for "knowledge is", but directly translated!) is not bad.

Marek

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Marek
  Mar 27, 07, 10:23  #39

Kilka or "kilku" slownikow...?
Marek

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Michal
  Mar 27, 07, 11:42  #40

Mam kilka slownikow

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Michal
  Mar 27, 07, 11:47  #41

deine polischkenntnisse ist ziemlich gut

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Marek
  Mar 27, 07, 12:54  #42

Polish seems more your baile wick than mine. I'll take your word for it about "kilka", not "kilku" in this instance.
Don't wish to appear arrogant. As I've often stated in this Forum; I don't profess to be always accurate in Polish, merely comfortably fluent.

Much appreciate your input!
Marek

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Marek
  Mar 27, 07, 13:01  #43

Michal,
Here, my friend, I must insist on "Deine Polnischkenntnisse sind.." (plural here!) in German, my second "jezyk maczerzynski". Ever noticed Germans speaking English often say, "I got many knowledges of...." instead of "I have much knowledge..."?

My recipe for learning a foreign language without translating, is to listen for the native-speaker errors the foreigner makes in English. This is often a good guide as to how THEIR own language works.
Marek

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Michal
  Mar 27, 07, 14:24  #44

I am very modest too and I must confes to knowing nothing about anything!

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Marek
  Mar 27, 07, 15:39  #45

Michal !

Remember (Pamietaj!): "A wise man knows that he knows not. A fool knows NOT that he knows not."
Marek

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Stevie
  Mar 27, 07, 21:46  #46

I will freely admit that I've become completely lost. I have this sneaking suspicion that you've reverted to languages not even relevant to this forum
But that's okay. You are still quite helpful. Danke, dziekuje and thank you

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Marek
  Mar 28, 07, 06:53  #47

Hi, Stevie!

Indeed, Michal and myself had made some forrays into "non-Polish" tongues, namely German, solely for explanatory purposes!

Apologies if you felt exluded. Bardzo mi przykro, ze nie moglas brac udzial w rozmowie.
Marek

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Stevie
  Mar 28, 07, 21:20  #48

Hey hey...what do you mean, not participate? Do you not seem me here, nodding along in total agreement with what you both say, confident as always that your linguistic utterances are fully and completely accurate. Plus, once I saw the word ist, I knew I was allowed to stop reading.
And as far as talking in Polish is concerned, by all means continue :P

Just wanted to say thank you again for your help. I won’t be here for a while. Jadę do Floryda w przyszlym tygodniu. Ale powrócę
ttyl

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Marek
  Mar 29, 07, 07:07  #49

Stevie!

Szczesliwej drogi a szybkiego spowrotu do domu.
Marek

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Michal
  Mar 29, 07, 08:53  #50

szczesliwej podrozy i szybkiego powrotu do domu. I think that the 'a' should be 'i'. Is there a word spowrot in Polish?

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Marek
  Mar 29, 07, 10:20  #51

Michal,
Good question! I've seen "spowrotu" or "s" + preposition in the context of an aspectual "happening only this one time"-type situation, e.g. " W zimie lezy cale miasto pod sniegem." ( in general) vs. "Zeszlego tygodnia lezalo cale miasto spod sniegem." (only this specific time, not necessarily always).
Marek

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