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Unemployed Poles in Ireland : a crash course in milking the system

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milky Threads: 20
Posts: 1,802
Joined: Oct 26, 2009
  ♀ Edited by: milky  Feb 24, 2012, 09:37am  #

Barney:
RN do you never smile, its a bollox story in a bollox paper

Good man Barney, that's for sure! some warped, orange leaning, right ring pr1cks write for it. kevin myers and Brendan O Connor(scum)I say no more.



noreenb Threads: 6
Posts: 807
Joined: Apr 22, 2009
  ♀ Feb 24, 2012, 12:17pm  #

I guess somebody who is "in love" with bezrobocie has "nierówno pod sufitem".
This is an illness and a disaster firstly for young than for old and elderly people.
No, it's not a disaster.
It' a tragedy. It's drama. It requires help.
Don't expect from me to translate what is "drama", please.
Peple who write in topics like this need help.
A lot of help. Their own help of course..


milky Threads: 20
Posts: 1,802
Joined: Oct 26, 2009
  ♀ Feb 24, 2012, 04:49pm  #

noreenb:
I guess somebody who is "in love" with bezrobocie has "nierówno pod sufitem".
This is an illness and a disaster firstly for young than for old and elderly people.
No, it's not a disaster.
It' a tragedy. It's drama. It requires help.
Don't expect from me to translate what is "drama", please.
Peple who write in topics like this need help.
A lot of help. Their own help of course..

Is this some kind of riddle??


oxon Threads: 6
Posts: 188
Joined: Feb 23, 2012
 Photos: 1  ♂ Feb 24, 2012, 06:07pm  #

Child benefit for Poles living here whilst their children have never set foot in the UK or Ireland is legal. This is the madness of our EU society. Overruled by the MEP's in Brussels and there ain't a dam thing we can do about it. Yet.!!!


thebadmonkey Threads: 2
Posts: 79
Joined: Feb 20, 2012
  ♂ Feb 24, 2012, 06:23pm  #

That's not actually true Oxon. Trust me, as an Irish person emigrating in the autumn, and as someone who has paid tens of thousands in tax over the past ten years, I've looked into it.

There's very strict rules with regards paying out Child Welfare. It's gotten even stricter of late into the bargain.


oxon Threads: 6
Posts: 188
Joined: Feb 23, 2012
 Photos: 1  ♂ Feb 24, 2012, 06:45pm  #

You need to ask some eastern European who is receiving child benefit whilst their child is in Poland for advice badMonkey. As far as I was aware there was no problem attaining this. Maybe someone can enlighten me.

Are you saying that it doesn't work the other way around? i.e. you emigrating to another country from Ireland and being denied this benefit?


thebadmonkey Threads: 2
Posts: 79
Joined: Feb 20, 2012
  ♂ Feb 24, 2012, 07:01pm  #

If both parents and child are not domiciled in the country, child benefit is not payable in Ireland but the EU country where you are residing.

"Residence of the Child

The child must be ordinarily resident in the State. This requirement is deemed to be satisfied in cases of:

members of the Irish Defence Forces or the Irish Civil Service serving abroad,
volunteer development workers, or
persons temporarily employed abroad by an Irish employer and paying Irish social insurance contributions."

"If you are an EU/EEA citizen or a Swiss national and work in a country covered by EU Regulations, the country you work in usually pays Child Benefit even if your family is living in another country."


RevokeNice Threads: 28
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Joined: Jun 20, 2009
 Photos: 1  ♂ Edited by: RevokeNice  Feb 25, 2012, 12:41am  #

thebadmonkey:
There's very strict rules with regards paying out Child Welfare. It's gotten even stricter of late into the bargain.


If a Pole comes to Ireland, has a child back home in Poland, the Pole is paid full Irish rates of child benefit. It matters not a jot if the child has never set foot on Irish soil. Twenty million, per annum, I do believe.

thebadmonkey:
"If you are an EU/EEA citizen or a Swiss national and work in a country covered by EU Regulations, the country you work in usually pays Child Benefit even if your family is living in another country."


Which backs up my previous point.

Out of interest, why were you looking up this legislation? Were you hoping to still receive child benefit from the exchequer, even when you and are kin will be no longer resident in the Irish state?

If so, lol.


ladykangaroo Threads: -
Posts: 178
Joined: Jan 2, 2009
  ♀ Edited by: ladykangaroo  Feb 25, 2012, 11:46am  #

RevokeNice:
It matters not a jot if the child has never set foot on Irish soil

As far as I know recently for a child benefit to be received a local GP has to sign the papers confirming that he is taking regular care of that particular child. That would mean that he has to see them on a regular basis, am I right?


However logical it sounds it seems to be against EU regulations and someone will challenge this procedure sooner or later.


RevokeNice Threads: 28
Posts: 3,171
Joined: Jun 20, 2009
 Photos: 1  ♂ Feb 25, 2012, 12:11pm  #

ladykangaroo:
As far as I know recently for a child benefit to be received a local GP has to sign the papers confirming that he is taking regular care of that particular child. That would mean that he has to see them on a regular basis, am I right?


Nope. A bert cert suffices.

Look after your own childers.

ladykangaroo:
However logical it sounds it seems to be against EU regulations and someone will challenge this procedure sooner or later.


Death to the EUnuchs. TAL!

Rise up Ireland!

IRELAND FOR THE INDIGENOUS IRISH PEOPLE!


Pushbike Threads: 3
Posts: 66
Joined: Feb 15, 2012
  ♂ Feb 25, 2012, 12:12pm  #

RevokeNice:
Repatriate aliens without a blood connection to the nation.

Revoke citizenship awarded to aliens.

Smart. Then every irish person would offer marriage for cash.


thebadmonkey Threads: 2
Posts: 79
Joined: Feb 20, 2012
  ♂ Edited by: thebadmonkey  Feb 25, 2012, 12:18pm  #

Nope revoke, because I am moving within my company from Dublin to Warsaw, I will be employed under my Irish contract until year end, paying tax in Ireland. This has an impact on where benefit will be paid and can lead to delays, hence my research.

As for benefit being paid based on where the primary earner works, I for one don't have a problem with that as they are contributing to state coffers and paying rent, buying food locally, thus contributing go the economy as a whole.

I take greater issue with the local scumbags for whom benefit has become a way of life, or single mothers who take advantage of the system to pay little or no rent for them and a boyfriend who officially doesn't exist. Immigration may be something that needs to be looked at but it's far down the chain. Abuse of social welfare by locals is far more of a drain on the economy as is a bloated, inefficient civil service and the fact banking executives who helped cause the crisis are still free and sitting on assets moved offshore. Never mind the xenophobic fear of being exploited about foreigners, it's local issues which have cost us dearly as a country. Hell, it may be unlawful-pc but I'm willing to wager socialnwelfare abuse by Irish Travellers is a greater problem..

Hmm you do know there's millions of Irish and English who have emigrated to work elsewhere over past 100 years? Who also have 'taken' jobs off locals and who avail of social welfare in those countries? And define indigenous


ladykangaroo Threads: -
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Joined: Jan 2, 2009
  ♀ Feb 25, 2012, 12:33pm  #

RevokeNice:
Nope. A bert cert suffices.

So you say.
My friends' experiences say the opposite.


Harry Threads: 100
Posts: 13,710
Joined: May 2, 2007
  ♂ Feb 25, 2012, 12:51pm  #

thebadmonkey:
Nope revoke, because I am moving within my company from Dublin to Warsaw, I will be employed under my Irish contract until year end, paying tax in Ireland.

Interesting, have you checked that one with the Polish tax office? They may have something to say about that (assuming that your place of residence will be in Poland).


thebadmonkey Threads: 2
Posts: 79
Joined: Feb 20, 2012
  ♂ Edited by: thebadmonkey  Feb 25, 2012, 12:57pm  #

Anti-fraud checks
EU/EEA citizens and Swiss national covered by EU Regulations are required to certify every 4 months that they continue to work in this State.

Unsure what form of certification this is, but does curtail abuse by people who have emigrated.

As for residency, it is over ruled by workplace to a certain extent ie a father works in Ireland with a wife and child in Poland. Poland must pay the benefit as per their own internal scales however the Irish state is eligible for 'topping up' the benefit to bring it in line with Irish rates.

Again as the father in this case is contributing to state coffers, don't see a problem with this one.


@ Harry I believe i will be eligible for tax in both, Ireland 'real time ' and then having to submit annual return to Polish tax authorities in 2013 for 2012. Pretty certain I'll get screwed by either side but such is life everywhere with tax


RevokeNice Threads: 28
Posts: 3,171
Joined: Jun 20, 2009
 Photos: 1  ♂ Feb 25, 2012, 07:34pm  #

thebadmonkey:
Nope revoke, because I am moving within my company from Dublin to Warsaw, I will be employed under my Irish contract until year end, paying tax in Ireland. This has an impact on where benefit will be paid and can lead to delays, hence my research.


Great news. One less culchie living in my city. Hopefully your polish mot is leaving too?

ladykangaroo:
My friends' experiences say the opposite.


80% of child benifit to children not living here goes to Poland
This cost soared to €20.9 million in 2008, up from €720,000 in 2005, due to high levels of immigration from central and eastern Europe from 2004 onwards.

No figures were released giving a detailed breakdown of where the 7,814 children live. But previous estimates from the department suggested up to 80 per cent of parents getting child benefit for non-resident children were Poles




thebadmonkey:
Hell, it may be unlawful-pc but I'm willing to wager socialnwelfare abuse by Irish Travellers is a greater problem..


There are 24,000 gypos in Ireland. There are circa 45000 eastern europeans in receipt of social welfare. Do the math.



THE Polish finance minister has expressed concern to Michael Noonan about Government plans to cut child benefit payments to Polish parents living here, but whose children are living in their home country.


The parents' home country usually pays the standard rate of child benefit, which in Poland is €11 per month. The Irish exchequer must then top this up to the full Irish rate -- €140 per month for a first and second child.


ladykangaroo Threads: -
Posts: 178
Joined: Jan 2, 2009
  ♀ Feb 25, 2012, 08:23pm  #

RevokeNice:
80% of child benifit to children not living here goes to Poland

You don't seem to be listening.

Nowadays to apply for a child benefit you are often asked to furnish the GP letter.
When applying for PPS number - you are often asked to provide a letter from employer confirming that you are working.
These are only two procedures (apparently aimed at cutting the social benefits people apply for) that I stumbled upon just recently, there may be more I am not aware of.

And although these internal measures sound reasonable and I could easily support them - they cannot be legally implemented. The cost of accessing EU 40 years ago.


RevokeNice:
€20.9 million in 2008

20 million? That's peanuts.
The new fancy court building in Dublin cost 7 times that.


Ironside Threads: 64
Posts: 8,812
Joined: Feb 26, 2009
  ♂ :-( Feb 25, 2012, 08:56pm  #

RevokeNice:
your polish mot

don't get jumpy elf and play nice.


teflcat Threads: 6
Posts: 1,419
Joined: May 29, 2011
  ♂ Feb 25, 2012, 09:38pm  #

RevokeNice:
24,000 gypos in Ireland.

Who the hell are these gypos, as you call them? Aren't they Irish people like yourself? I grew up in a part of London where there was a camp down the road with what in those days were called tinkers or pikies, and a lot of them were Irish. We rubbed along alright most of the time, except for the odd time when there was a break-in and they were, of course, blamed (a story a thousand years old).


RevokeNice Threads: 28
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Joined: Jun 20, 2009
 Photos: 1  ♂ Edited by: RevokeNice  Feb 25, 2012, 10:33pm  #

teflcat:
Who the hell are these gypos, as you call them?


Ive no issue with the knackers. And yes. they are ethnic Irish.

ladykangaroo:
Nowadays to apply for a child benefit you are often asked to furnish the GP letter.


Often asked? And say these "GP" practices in some village on the Polish border. Do the social send a team to investigate or do they take the "GP"s signature as gospel?
ladykangaroo:
When applying for PPS number - you are often asked to provide a letter from employer confirming that you are working.


Wrong.

You cant work legally without a PPS number. NO reputable business would employ someone without a PPS number.

Everyone, legally resident in the state, is entitled to a PPS number. Even people whom cannot legally work, i.e asylum seekers.

Ive recently been forced to undergo a course in employment law. So I suggest you stop spoofing.

ladykangaroo:
And although these internal measures sound reasonable and I could easily support them - they cannot be legally implemented. The cost of accessing EU 40 years ago.


Show me EU legislation that pertains your view, i.e that member states must pay child benefit to non resident children.

Ta.

If you do, I will donate a crisp one hundred euro bill to a charity of your choice. With evidence posted on here.

But you wont be able to, as it doesnt exist.

Stop spoofing.

ladykangaroo:
20 million? That's peanuts.


It could build a hospital. A few schools. Employ 400 nurses for a year.

ladykangaroo:
The new fancy court building in Dublin cost 7 times that.


Great stuff. Nice building too.


Point is?


ladykangaroo Threads: -
Posts: 178
Joined: Jan 2, 2009
  ♀ Edited by: ladykangaroo  Feb 25, 2012, 11:36pm  #

RevokeNice:
And say these "GP" practices in some village on the Polish border

"Local" as my previous post said. Local - as Irish. However having in mind how ridiculously understaffed Irish practices are there is a good chance the GP himself will be from India, Poland or France.

RevokeNice:
You cant work legally without a PPS number. NO reputable business would employ someone without a PPS number.

They would, they did and they will. The only ones hit really hard by the lack of PPS no. are the employees - the resulting emergency tax can be quite painful to the pocket.

RevokeNice:
Everyone, legally resident in the state, is entitled to a PPS number

True. That's why asking for a letter from employer can and will never get official.

Gosh, I start to doubt if you really live in Ireland. The complete detachment from the reality...



RevokeNice:
Show me EU legislation that pertains your view

http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/internal_market/living_and_work ing_in_the_internal_market/c10521_en.htm

Barnardos Ireland, please.


RevokeNice Threads: 28
Posts: 3,171
Joined: Jun 20, 2009
 Photos: 1  ♂ Feb 25, 2012, 11:57pm  #

ladykangaroo:
http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/internal_market/living_an d_work ing_in_the_internal_market/c10521_en.htm

Barnardos Ireland, please.

A person is entitled to family benefits in a competent Member State, including for members of his/her family residing in another Member State, as if they were residing in the former Member State.


ladykangaroo Threads: -
Posts: 178
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  ♀ Edited by: ladykangaroo  Feb 26, 2012, 12:02am  #

RevokeNice:
A person is entitled to family benefits in a competent Member State

Person working / living in Ireland.

RevokeNice:
including for members of his/her family residing in another Member State


Self-explanatory.

I understand even now you are ready to provide an alternative explanation?


RevokeNice Threads: 28
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Joined: Jun 20, 2009
 Photos: 1  ♂ Feb 26, 2012, 12:32am  #

ladykangaroo:
I understand even now you are ready to provide an alternative explanation?

I was admitting that I was wrong. Il donate that money during the week and post a photo of the receipt.


thebadmonkey Threads: 2
Posts: 79
Joined: Feb 20, 2012
  ♂ Feb 26, 2012, 10:42am  #

Was talking to my 'mot' last night about it. She did indeed need a letter signed by the GP for the purposes of child benefit (PPS number right of child, confirmation he has seen it and that the child is taking part in vaccination program)

And yeah am a culchie, see no shame in being from the countryside or indeed looking abroad for opportunities. Keeping on open mind isn't the evil you seem to think it.


ladykangaroo Threads: -
Posts: 178
Joined: Jan 2, 2009
  ♀ Feb 26, 2012, 11:49am  #

RevokeNice:
I was admitting

Thank you.

RevokeNice:
post a photo of the receipt

No need to, I trust you in this matter.


RevokeNice Threads: 28
Posts: 3,171
Joined: Jun 20, 2009
 Photos: 1  ♂ Feb 26, 2012, 10:52pm  #

thebadmonkey:
And yeah am a culchie, see no shame in being from the countryside or indeed looking abroad for opportunities. Keeping on open mind isn't the evil you seem to think it.


See how I guessed that just from your posts.

Culchies are as alien to Dublin as the slavs. They also tend to support mass immigration, as they cannot find friends or forge meaningful relationships with the natives, in Du .


thebadmonkey Threads: 2
Posts: 79
Joined: Feb 20, 2012
  ♂ Feb 26, 2012, 11:15pm  #

You really are an obnoxious little toad aren't you? Thank the gods you don't represent the majority of Irish - culchie or otherwise.


RevokeNice Threads: 28
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Joined: Jun 20, 2009
 Photos: 1  ♂ Edited by: Moderator  Feb 26, 2012, 11:26pm  #

thebadmonkey:
Thank the gods you don't represent the majority of Irish - culchie or otherwise.


I am a Dub first and foremost.

Culchies in Dublin are just as much a threat to the native working class as the slav scab workers.

When are you leaving btw?

Make sure to visit Hill 16 and tell the natives that they are inferior to the foreigners.

Mouthy culchie. Farmers son?

Cut the personal stuff, please


SeanBM Threads: 48
Posts: 8,344
Joined: Mar 10, 2008
  ♂ Edited by: SeanBM  Feb 27, 2012, 01:00am  #

RevokeNice:
Culchies are as alien to Dublin

Now he's on about people from Ireland being alien to the capital of Ireland.

Sad lonely loon. same old, same old.

How's your "millionaire sister" that you spunge off, doin now? you still can't hold down a job, no doubt there. and the Vlogs, gettin much support with them? or just people laughin their arses off at ya? How many users names have you on here now? (sure I'll soon find out). Still gettin banned from forums for bein a complete prick no doubt.

you're a disgrace, keep postin and given us all a laugh, funny boy :)



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