Why dont americans want a universal health care system?

mvefaThreads: 11 Posts: 971 Joined: Jul 21, 09 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 15:51 #1
Share your thoughts with the rest!

FredChopinThreads: - Posts: 138 Joined: Jul 26, 09 ♂	Edited by: FredChopin Aug 4, 09, 15:55 #2
The big medical companies would feel the pressure to reduce costs (read: profits). I am sure the biggest opponents are the drug companies / medical service suppliers.

z_dariusThreads: 22 Posts: 5,091 Joined: Oct 18, 07 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 15:56 #3
because they are afraid of slogans. This time the slogan is "socialized medicine". They have no idea what it means, and they have socialized roads and socialized military but when it comes to medical care, no way. God forbid it would work. What then?

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Aug 4, 09, 16:12 #4

i read sometime ago at the webpage of reuters, the results of a poll they made, most of the people was scared of the word "socializing" and a very large number answered: "i dont want to pay for other people"

Ironic isn't it? i mean they pay it anyway, the difference is that they prefer their money go to rich share-holders instead of poor old-nanny who cannot pay exorbitantly expensive medicine...

oh well...

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Aug 4, 09, 16:13 #5

A guy on the radio said "If you want health care reform get off the couch and move around" and that's what Americans need to do. Who wants to pay for all these Americans who choose to sit around loading up on junk food and ruining their health in the process so it costs billions of dollars to fix them? Who wants to pay for their smoking and other bad habits? Trim the fat from America first, then offer universal health care or you are going to have more people sitting around getting horrifically fat thinking a doctor can fix them with gastric bi passes.

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Edited by: tj123 Aug 4, 09, 16:20 #6

Funny how all the rich people in socialist nations got to the private hospitals and pay for the better doctors...you don't see celebrities in Poland waiting forever in the lobby of the government clinics for the kid right out of school and the senile, retired 90yo MD making extra money working part time there. Why would they do that if the socialized systems are so great? Let's face it, neither system is "good". They both put money before people...one through taxes and waiting for procedures and one by expensive payment at the kasa.

mvefaThreads: 11 Posts: 971 Joined: Jul 21, 09 ♂	Edited by: mvefa Aug 4, 09, 16:24 #7
It's true, both systems suck, but the socialist system is slightly better, i mean you will not be dropped out by your insurance company if you become too expensive, Also i know if i get really sick, i won't have to worry about digging out my savings, selling my house etc. Better to pay a bit more per month than unsecurity..hope they come up with a better solution for both worlds.

time meansThreads: 9 Posts: 2,309 Joined: Apr 21, 08 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 16:25 #8
Be it education or medicine if you have the money you will always go private! tj is bang on.

z_dariusThreads: 22 Posts: 5,091 Joined: Oct 18, 07 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 16:27 #9
tj123: unny how all the rich people in socialist nations got to the private hospitals and pay for the better doctors I hear of few French taking the trip to the US for medical care. The US has no health care at all. Socialized or otherwise. The US has a medical industry, no different than potato fields, banking system or the so called automotive industry.

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Edited by: tj123 Aug 4, 09, 16:28 #10

mvefa:

i mean you will not be dropped out by your insurance company if you become too expensive, Also i know if i get really sick, i won't have to worry about digging out my savings, selling my house etc.

But you may get sicker or die waiting for your turn. Again neither system is good in the end and neither better than the other in the end.

z_darius:

The US has no health care at all. Socialized or otherwise. The US has a medical industry, no different than potato fields, banking system or the so called automotive industry.

To say it is any different in the social system is dishonest. In one private organizations profit..in the other government profits. Whether you get good care depends if you have the luck to draw a competent doctor in either system...

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Edited by: PlasticPole Aug 4, 09, 16:32 #11

z_darius:

The US has no health care at all. Socialized or otherwise. The US has a medical industry, no different than potato fields, banking system or the so called automotive industry.

Not exactly. If you have health insurance it's pretty good as long as you are relatively healthy. The main problem here is conflict of interest which is why it should be socialized. Forget about making a profit because there isn't going to be one. Work on keeping people from getting too fat in the first place.
Something needs to be done about health insurers and if the government starts giving them more money they will be unstoppable as far as greedily gobbling up every dollar because they already think they are God.

mvefaThreads: 11 Posts: 971 Joined: Jul 21, 09 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 16:33 #12
let''s see

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Aug 4, 09, 16:34 #13

tj123:

In one private organizations profit..in the other government profits.

How does the French government profit from their "socialized" health care". Got some numbers?

tj123:

Whether you get good care depends if you have the luck to draw a competent doctor in either system.

Agreed. Nothing inherently better in either system as far as the quality of doctors goes. I've had some great example of top notch medical care in the US, Canada, France, Germany and Poland. I also had some of the worst experiences in the US, Canada and Poland.

FredChopinThreads: - Posts: 138 Joined: Jul 26, 09 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 16:35 #14
tj123: Whether you get good care depends if you have the luck to draw a competent doctor in either system... Also depends on the back log in the system. You may get a great doctor, but if you have to wait 6 months to see him, you could be dead.

mvefaThreads: 11 Posts: 971 Joined: Jul 21, 09 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 16:36 #15
tj123: But you may get sicker or die waiting for your turn. Again neither system is good in the end and neither better than the other in the end. Been sick a couple of times, i was schedule the same week for especialists, medicine and treatment all free of costs...

PlasticPoleThreads: 10 Posts: 5,181 Joined: May 28, 09 ♀	Aug 4, 09, 16:37 #16
mvefa: free of costs... It's not actually free...

markcooperThreads: 6 Posts: 113 Joined: Apr 27, 09 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 16:40 #17
[b]Why don't americans want a univeral healthcare system.[/b] ? ? Another American illusion. A healthcare service that provides for the population regardless of financial status.? The current system works fine for CEO's and major shareholders of the pharmaceuticals If you can not pay then there is no healthcare system. Anyway they are retarded people from a retarded country.

mvefaThreads: 11 Posts: 971 Joined: Jul 21, 09 ♂	Edited by: mvefa Aug 4, 09, 16:43 #18
Off course it is not free of costs, cause in the in end we all pay for we all...but you know what i mean! I wouldn't say "retarded" to all the american comunity, its just that most of the active generation was raised in the cold-war era, therefore anything that sounds like "socialism" scares the hell out of them...

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Aug 4, 09, 16:49 #19

markcooper:

Another American illusion. A healthcare service that provides for the population regardless of financial status.? The current system works fine for CEO's and major shareholders of the
pharmaceuticals

I would modify that take slightly.
This is how it works:

1 the rich don't care, they have a mountain of dollars.
2 the poor get patched up (accidents, emergencies) but no long term care such as cancer treatment
3 the insured middle class - get health care approved by the insurance company, not by doctors
4 the uninsured middle class - get the second mortgage on their houses to pay for medical bills, soon thereafter they go under and are moved to category #2 and thus, indeed, get free medical care, for emergencies only.

♂

Edited by: plk123 Aug 4, 09, 16:57 #20

PlasticPole:

A guy on the radio said "If you want health care reform get off the couch and move around" and that's what Americans need to do. Who wants to pay for all these Americans who choose to sit around loading up on junk food and ruining their health in the process so it costs billions of dollars to fix them? Who wants to pay for their smoking and other bad habits? Trim the fat from America first, then offer universal health care or you are going to have more people sitting around getting horrifically fat thinking a doctor can fix them with gastric bi passes.

who do you think pays for them anyway.. especially when they show up at the ER (the most expensive "healthcare" around?

mvefa:

Also i know if i get really sick, i won't have to worry about digging out my savings, selling my house

you won't have to.. you'll die waiting.. :D

tj123:

In one private organizations profit..in the other government profits.

lol.. the gov. does NOT profit.

♂

Edited by: mvefa Aug 4, 09, 16:57 #21

PlasticPole:

Who wants to pay for all these Americans who choose to sit around

Not sure if thats the main reason, strange, because for business and family reasons, i go very often to the USA, for 3-4 weeks every now and then.

I do a lot, move around and go places, but still i come back home with 2-3 kilos extra...im sure its the food, they put something in there which makes you grow fat...

plk123:

you won't have to.. you'll die waiting.. :D

haha dont be dramatic, i've never heard of anyone dying for waiting...ever...

tj123Threads: - Posts: 104 Joined: Jul 31, 09 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 17:04 #22
plk123: lol.. the gov. does NOT profit. Ok...I guess if people want to believe that. Last time I looked I never saw a poor senator or senior government official. If anyone thinks the only profit they gain is their salary then they are blind. It is a giant game and business.

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,410 Joined: Aug 29, 07 ♂	Edited by: plk123 Aug 4, 09, 17:04 #23
no, it's just you man, mv mvefa: haha dont be dramatic, i've never heard of anyone dying for waiting...ever... it happens here a lot already.. it happens in canada even more.

mvefaThreads: 11 Posts: 971 Joined: Jul 21, 09 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 17:05 #24
drantico palmani

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,410 Joined: Aug 29, 07 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 17:06 #25
tj123: Ok...I guess if people want to believe that. Last time I looked I never saw a poor senator or senior government official. If anyone thinks the only profit they gain is their salary then they are blind. It is a giant game and business. dude, gov is non for profit.

mvefaThreads: 11 Posts: 971 Joined: Jul 21, 09 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 17:06 #26
haha anyway there must be something there, i mean i eat like a pig here, never gain a kilo, did the same in all the countries i've ever lived/travelled to,, never gained a gram..only there....friends of mine had the same thing...no idea what it is

plk123Threads: 30 Posts: 6,410 Joined: Aug 29, 07 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 17:08 #27
you come here and get in a car.. probably don't even walk but a few yards..

mvefaThreads: 11 Posts: 971 Joined: Jul 21, 09 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 17:29 #28
I walk and use the car, the same amount of time i do in europa actually...just a strange thought....

♂

Aug 4, 09, 18:35 #29

Cars are one thing, but the vending machines in schools quite another.
They ban cigarettes wherever they can but McDonald's is still legal. That is bewildering to me.

Recently I read an article where they wrote genetically modified food is actually better for you than organically grown food. Thanks to subsidies by the likes of Monsanto, of course.

It is clear god made some serious mistakes only men can fix. Hence, the concept of "intelligent design" falls flat on its rear end.

RakkyThreads: 10 Posts: 284 Joined: May 23, 07 ♂	Aug 4, 09, 19:01 #30
"Why dont americans want a universal health care system?" On what do you base your assumption that Americans do not want a universal health care system?

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