Polack/American Polonia/Plastic Pole "culture"

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Oct 27, 10, 22:58 #1

Sooo.. I was told to start a thread.

Is it only me that finds the American "Polonia" attitude towards Poland irritating and downright insulting towards real Polish people?

They talk about "Busha" as if it's a real Polish word for Grandmother (in fact, most of them believe it is), they use Jaja (isn't this eggs?) for their grandfather. If that was all, I wouldn't mind - but when you get them talking about eating "pierogies" and then getting upset because Poland in 2010 is nothing like Lwów in 1930 (like Busha said) - it's bordering on ridiculous.

We won't even discuss how they talk about being so proudly Polish, yet they can't speak the language. These people are NOT Polish, they are "Polacks". Why? Because many of them don't even understand that the Polish word for a male Pole is "Polak" - but they've chosen to take offence.

Then there's the way that many of them completely mispronounce their "Polish" name. The worst example? I found a video on youtube of someone called "Marchewka". Anyone living in Poland will know that it's pronounced something similar to "mar-hef-ka" - but to the Polonia? It's "Mar-Chew-Ka". Gah.

Seriously, why do real Poles put up with them?

convexThreads: 46 Posts: 7,185 Joined: Nov 25, 09 ♂	Oct 27, 10, 23:00 #2
delphiandomine: Seriously, why do real Poles put up with them? Why shouldn't they? Even though it's somewhat diluted, isn't it a bit of Polish culture overseas? I for one don't mind eating "pierogies" in Oklahoma :)

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Oct 27, 10, 23:05 #3

convex:

Why shouldn't they? Even though it's somewhat diluted, isn't it a bit of Polish culture overseas? I for one don't mind eating "pierogies" in Oklahoma :)

I think it's just the general way that they seem to think that they're Polish, but they are so completely removed from Plish life that it's not even funny. Take the whole Smolensk issue - the Polonia media was/is full of complete garbage about it - essentially regurgitated Kaczynski talk.

Then there's the way that they get offended on Poland's behalf, when Poland isn't even offended. And we won't talk about the way that they get upset when they come to Poland, because it's "morally decaying" or some such nonsense.

Adam "An-gee-ew-ski" was probably the best example of this.

Polonius3Threads: 1,005 Posts: 4,835 Joined: Apr 11, 08 ♂	Oct 27, 10, 23:06 #4
Polglish (a la: Nasza nejberka klinuje flory w ofisie za osiem baków i kwodra) as well as Engpol (a la: We was on a wedding yesterday and today we gonna go by busia's and then to the poprawiny) are ethnic dialects in their own right, no more deserving of ridicule than the Franglais of Québec or the Afro-speak of America's slums.

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Oct 27, 10, 23:10 #5

delphiandomine:

I think it's just the general way that they seem to think that they're Polish, but they are so completely removed from Plish life that it's not even funny. Take the whole Smolensk issue - the Polonia media was/is full of complete garbage about it - essentially regurgitated Kaczynski talk.

Is it that they're voting "conservative"?

delphiandomine:

Then there's the way that they get offended on Poland's behalf, when Poland isn't even offended. And we won't talk about the way that they get upset when they come to Poland, because it's "morally decaying" or some such nonsense.

So it's a feeling of superiority?

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Edited by: delphiandomine Oct 27, 10, 23:11 #6

Polonius3:

(a la: We was on a wedding yesterday and today we gonna go by busia's and then to the poprawiny) are ethnic dialects in their own right

But they should stop pretending that it's Polish in that case. Everyone knows Quebecois French is nothing like the French spoken in "Le Metropole" (or is it La? I forget... ).

And they absolutely should stop insisting that Busha is the Polish word for grandmother. Interestingly, the Western Ukraine word for Grandmother is "Babusha".

Oh, and the other thing that gets on my nerves - the insistence that their family came from Poland, even before the Polish State was re-established. "I'M FROM POLAND"....no mate, you really aren't.

convex:

Is it that they're voting "conservative"?

The odd thing is why they appear to vote Kaczynski, yet idol-worship Walesa and vote Democrat. Doesn't make any sense at all!

So it's a feeling of superiority?

I wish I knew. They seem to believe that Poland is some sort of utopia, myths purportrated seemingly by the grandparents. And then there's the lunatics who insist that they're from Poland, even when it seems that their grandparents/great-grandparents were actually from pre-1945 Germany!

Of course, many of them only discovered how Polish they were after 2004.

(mind you, many Jews did too...)

grubasThreads: 20 Posts: 1,452 Joined: Feb 1, 10 ♂	Oct 27, 10, 23:21 #7
Yea whatever dude I just had some pierogis and holubkis and now I am going to visit my Busha and Jaja.I know you are just being jealous because you don't live in the US but in a poor Poland.Yea you suck.

delphiandomineThreads: 42 Posts: 9,954 Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ [Suspended]	Oct 27, 10, 23:22 #8
grubas: I know you are just being jealous because you don't live in the US but in a poor Poland. Worst thing is, that seems to be their attitude - that Poland is poor, and while it's fine to come and visit (and look down at) the relatives, it's not for staying in. Yet they claim to be proud Poles. Ugh.

grubasThreads: 20 Posts: 1,452 Joined: Feb 1, 10 ♂	Oct 27, 10, 23:28 #9
delphiandomine: that Poland is poor It is poor indeed, because it is run by a bunch of morons elected by even more morons.

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Oct 27, 10, 23:36 #10

delphiandomine:

Sooo.. I was told to start a thread.

Is it only me that finds the American "Polonia" attitude towards Poland irritating and downright insulting towards real Polish people?

They talk about "Busha" as if it's a real Polish word for Grandmother (in fact, most of them believe it is), they use Jaja (isn't this eggs?) for their grandfather. If that was all, I wouldn't mind - but when you get them talking about eating "pierogies" and then getting upset because Poland in 2010 is nothing like Lwów in 1930 (like Busha said) - it's bordering on ridiculous.

We won't even discuss how they talk about being so proudly Polish, yet they can't speak the language. These people are NOT Polish, they are "Polacks". Why? Because many of them don't even understand that the Polish word for a male Pole is "Polak" - but they've chosen to take offence.

Then there's the way that many of them completely mispronounce their "Polish" name. The worst example? I found a video on youtube of someone called "Marchewka". Anyone living in Poland will know that it's pronounced something similar to "mar-hef-ka" - but to the Polonia? It's "Mar-Chew-Ka". Gah.

Seriously, why do real Poles put up with them?

Good Gawwwwd. Talk about desperately trying to make mountains out of molehills to bring divisions between Poles in Poland and their relatives outside of Poland.

Nice job troll LOL

Its amazing that in a Polishforum, a blatantly childish anti-Polish thread can be started to try to create divisions between Poles in Poland and the Polish diaspora by someone who has admitted that he is not of Polish ancestry, has admitted he speaks Polish badly (he couldn't care a less about speaking Polish) and who has attacked not just the Polish diaspora but Poles in Poland. Then he has the nerve to imply that he is the great arbiter and judge on all things concerning Poles in Poland and their relatives in the Polish diaspora.

Delphiandomine can throw around slurs about Poles being Polacks but God forbid I give him a taste of his own medicine and call him a Russky. For that I'm criticized by the moderator for some reason. I don't know why I should be criticized for my thoughts when this blatant Polish-hater delphiandomine can get away with bashing people of Polish ancestry all day long and not posting anything productive. I personally notice his hostility goes up after I make comments about Russia in reaction to his condescending comments about Poland, Poles in Poland and Polonia.

Even though delphiandomine has bashed Poles in Poland he then hypocritically tries to act like the great champion of Poles in Poland despite all his bashing of them and almost always diminishing any kind of achievements from Poles.

But nevertheless this forum is not just about Poles in Poland. That's why its called the Polishforum and not the Polandforum. Its about people of Polish ancestry everywhere in the world which seems to drive the Polish-Hater delphiadomine crazy. There is a reason why this forum is in the language that most of the Polish diaspora speaks.

1jolaThreads: 33 Posts: 2,737 Joined: Sep 23, 08 ♂	Oct 27, 10, 23:39 #11
delphiandomine: Seriously, why do real Poles put up with them? We like people of Polish descent who are interested in Polish culture, history, etc. Unlike you, we are not that critical about the small stuff. Relax, and start a cool thread instead of this nonsense.

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Oct 27, 10, 23:47 #12

MediaWatch:

Talk about desperately trying to make mountains out of molehills to bring divisions between Poles in Poland and their relatives outside of Poland.

The divisions are already there. Just look at the Presidential Election - when America was so massively out of sync with the rest of the world, you know fine well that the people voting were American, not Polish.

Perhaps you choose to deny it, but I, as a European, have far more in common with Poland than Americans do.

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Oct 27, 10, 23:47 #13

1jola:

We like people of Polish descent who are interested in Polish culture, history, etc. Unlike you, we are not that critical about the small stuff. Relax, and start a cool thread instead of this nonsense.

Yes you are right.

Poles in general don't sweat the small stuff and its true Poles in Poland appreciate anyone who appreciates their culture. Its just like how Italian Americans appreciate Italy and vice versa, German Americans appreciate Germany and vice versa, etc.

Most Poles in Poland and people in the Polish diaspora are generally easy going people. They are not as anal as this anti-Pole delphiamdomine tries so desperately to imply.

The last person to make comments on Poles in Poland or the Polish diaspora is this angry guy delphiandomine.

I really hope delphiadomine gets some psychiatric help soon.

guesswhoThreads: 23 Posts: 3,326 Joined: Mar 17, 10 ♀	Oct 27, 10, 23:54 #14
Tell me guys, what does the "plastic Pole" really stand for, a Polish-American or a green-card Pole? I'm asking because before joining this forum, I never came across this description.

MEMBER ♂

Edited by: Torq Oct 27, 10, 23:56 #15

I admit I've been a bit of an arsehole talking about "Plastic Poles" on several occassions,
but I didn't mean it as a real insult. More of a tongue in cheek teasing (just like the Irish
sometimes call their diaspora "Plastic Paddies".)

If anyone feels ties with his Polish ancestry and is proud to talk about it, cherish it and develop
interest in all things Polish, while living many thousand kilometres away from the Fatherland then
I can only express my liking and feeling of kinship towards such person.

If you're a Pole, you're a Pole (or a person of Polish ancestry). All this talk about Plastic Poles
is just tongue in cheek slagging. Greetings to all Poles in diaspora (and their descendants.)
Take care of yourselves out there, people!

MediaWatchThreads: 31 Posts: 1,305 Joined: Aug 30, 08 ♂	Oct 27, 10, 23:57 #16
guesswho: Tell me guys, what does the "plastic Pole" really stand for, a Polish-American or a green-card Pole? I'm asking because before joining this forum, I never came across this description. Me too. I never heard the phrase "Plastic Pole" before coming to this forum either. I guess somebody somewhere, with a lot of time on his hands, sits down and makes up these phrases LOL

WroclawThreads: 77 Posts: 7,404 Joined: Apr 1, 06 ♂ [Moderator]	Oct 27, 10, 23:58 #17
MediaWatch: and its true Poles in Poland appreciate anyone who appreciates their culture not all. there was a news item about a week ago about how the mountain folk here are not happy with folk in the usa. it was about wearing the wrong traditional costume etc.

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Edited by: delphiandomine Oct 28, 10, 00:00 #18

guesswho:

Tell me guys, what does the "plastic Pole" really stand for, a Polish-American or a green-card Pole? I'm asking because before joining this forum, I never came across this description.

Hmm - could be either, but I'd use the term more to describe those who aren't Polish, who don't speak the language, who make a big show out of doing "Polish" things and who tend to be very sensitive about Poland being criticised in anyway. They're Plastic - because - they're only Polish when it suits them. If they were forced to choose, they'd pick American. They're the ones who get upset with the term "Polak/Polack", because they're so ignorant that they don't know what it means.

It can also be used for those Poles who have lived in America so long, who have got American citizenship and who have absolutely no intention of returning - usually the ones who pretend that they've forgotten Polish and that they regard everything Polish as being inferior.

It's a PF invention I think, but it does describe them rather well.

MediaWatch:

Poles in general don't sweat the small stuff and its true Poles in Poland appreciate anyone who appreciates their culture.

That's why there was a significant amount of hostility towards the American Polonia interfering in the Polish Presidential election this year, then?

As I say - I'm on the ground and living here. You're not.

The thing that makes me laugh most of all is the way that the Polonia insists that they are TRUE POLES - yet many of them know -

a) nothing about the partitions
b) nothing about the difference between nationality and ethnicity (and how it's changed)
c) nothing about Poland apart from what "Busha" told them
d) nothing about being Polish
e) nothing about the likelihood of someone being 100% genetically Polish

guesswhoThreads: 23 Posts: 3,326 Joined: Mar 17, 10 ♀	Oct 28, 10, 00:01 #19
MediaWatch: I never heard the phrase "Plastic Pole" before coming to this forum either. Well, I could imagine, to someone of Polish origin it sounds kinda derogatory.

MediaWatchThreads: 31 Posts: 1,305 Joined: Aug 30, 08 ♂	Oct 28, 10, 00:03 #20
Wroclaw: not all. there was a news item about a week ago about how the mountain folk here are not happy with folk in the usa. it was about wearing the wrong traditional costume etc. Well nothing is 100%. But I think this kind of thing happens with all nations and their diaspora from time to time all over the world. No?

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Edited by: delphiandomine Oct 28, 10, 00:04 #21

guesswho:

Well, I could imagine, to someone of Polish origin it sounds kinda derogatory.

It is derogatory. It's meant to be insulting - these people are claiming to be Polish, yet it's all lip-service. How many of them actually volunteered for Polish military service, I wonder?

As a minimum - if you're claiming to be Polish, then you should change your last name to the proper Polish spelling (not some weird bastardisation) and pronounce it correctly too.

MediaWatch:

But I think this kind of thing happens with all nations and their diaspora from time to time all over the world. No?

Doesn't matter - if you claim to be something, then you should be authentic rather than insulting.

I wonder how many of our Plastic Poles know the national anthem? I know it, and I'm not Polish.

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Edited by: SeanBM Oct 28, 10, 00:08 #22

grubas:

You guys(and gals) need to leave PL!GO HOME!No need for you here.most polish ppl DO NOT need or want you here.Again GO HOME!And before anybody start bragging about polish ppl whereever,let me tell you :give them an good example, go home and tell them to do the same.So do not wait start packing your s**t today and GTHO tomorrow.POLAND for POLES (ONLY)!!!

mod:

grubas - posting from the USA and not PL.

To ALL IMMIGRANTS ("expats") to PL on this forum...

Things like this (see above), I think are stupid.

But I can understand why Polish people like Polish Americans and Visa Versa.

It's like the Irish, I can meet Irish Americans and have the craic :)

zetigrekThreads: 59 Posts: 2,709 Joined: May 20, 10 ♂	Oct 28, 10, 00:11 #23
delphiandomine: Why? Because many of them don't even understand that the Polish word for a male Pole is "Polak" - but they've chosen to take offence. Well I'm real Polish from Poland and I take it offensive. Note that Polack have different spelling than Polak.

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Oct 28, 10, 00:12 #24

SeanBM:

grubas:
You guys(and gals) need to leave PL!GO HOME!No need for you here.most polish ppl DO NOT need or want you here.Again GO HOME!And before anybody start bragging about polish ppl whereever,let me tell you :give them an good example, go home and tell them to do the same.So do not wait start packing your s**t today and GTHO tomorrow.POLAND for POLES (ONLY)!!!

grubas - posting from the USA and not PL.

Yea so what?

delphiandomineThreads: 42 Posts: 9,954 Joined: Nov 25, 08 ♂ [Suspended]	Oct 28, 10, 00:14 #25
zetigrek: Well I'm real Polish from Poland and I take it offensive. Note that Polack have different spelling than Polak. Polack, Polak, what's the difference? Polack is just the dumb American spelling anyway ;) (anyway, in English, there's lots of words for people of foreign nationalities - Frog, Kraut, etc)

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Oct 28, 10, 00:19 #26

When all you PRL-ovians or your parents were brown-nosing and playing ball with the Soviet-installed regime, obediently paying homage to the red leaders in Mayday parades, mouthing Soviet lies at school, joining the ZMS and suchlike to further your careers and gain, promotions, perks and privileges, it was the Polonia that kept the Polish spirit alive, tirelessly pressing for Poland's independence at every opportuntiy, keeping alive the truth about Katyń and other historical events. Polonians did so because they felt pride in their Polish heritage and love for their ancestral homeland, even many of those already born abroad.

guesswhoThreads: 23 Posts: 3,326 Joined: Mar 17, 10 ♀	Oct 28, 10, 00:20 #27
delphiandomine: I know it, and I'm not Polish. You sound like one. Actually, you come across like a pretty much, peed off Pole living in Poland. I hope it doesn't sound insulting because it's not my intention. To be honest, why would a living in Poland foreigner, be mad at Polish Americans the way you are? Just a question.

WroclawThreads: 77 Posts: 7,404 Joined: Apr 1, 06 ♂ [Moderator]	Oct 28, 10, 00:23 #28
MediaWatch: But I think this kind of thing happens with all nations and their diaspora from time to time all over the world. true enough. some people might seem to be over keen to celebrate their roots and go a little overboard. this might then embarrass a few traditionalists back at home. the rest just see people having a good time.

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Edited by: delphiandomine Oct 28, 10, 00:24 #29

Polonius3:

When all you PRL-ovians or your parents were brown-nosing and playing ball with the Soviet-installed regime, obediently paying homage to the red leaders in Mayday parades, mouthing Soviet lies at school, joining the ZMS and suchlike to further your careers and gain, promotions, perks and privileges, it was the Polonia that kept the Polish spirit alive, tirelessly pressing for Poland's independence at every opportuntiy, keeping alive the truth about Katyń and other historical events. Polonians did so because they felt pride in their Polish heritage and love for their ancestral homeland, even many of those already born abroad.

Sorry Polonius, but I think those people were cowards through and through. The real opposition was inside Poland, the ones who were willing to get killed in their fight for freedom. The ones who formed underground resistance, the ones who were willing to put up with endless harrassment in the name of freedom.

It hardly took guts to shout about Katyn from several thousand miles away, under the shield of Uncle Sam - but it damn sure took guts to talk about it in the PRL. Likewise - it's nothing for some Chicago Polish American Katyn 1940 group to go around demanding that the West apologise for it - it was another thing to be demanding this in public in the PRL.

If the Polonia are really so out of touch as to believe that they, not the Polish people themselves were the ones fighting for freedom, then no wonder they're all absolutely delusional.

Sorry, but the Poles in Poland are the ones that deserve praise, not a bunch of cowards in another continent. Let's not forget that the same Polonia either ran away from the PRL or they ran away at the start of the 2nd Republic. Hardly the work of Polish patriots, is it?

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Edited by: zetigrek Oct 28, 10, 00:24 #30

delphiandomine:

Polack, Polak, what's the difference? Polack is just the dumb American spelling anyway ;)

For real Pole - huge.

delphiandomine:

(anyway, in English, there's lots of words for people of foreign nationalities - Frog, Kraut, etc)

And they all are kinds of disrespectful terms. How about polish words like: szwab, pepiczek, knedel, rusek, makaroniarz, żabojad. Their etymology is also ingenuous...
Also famouse N1gger have innocent etymology (the tradition and common context of useage made it deregatory)

Btw. Delphian what's your nationality?

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