Who designs houses in Poland?

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Edited by: magpie Oct 15, 11, 21:16 #1

Larger developments aside, do the smaller builders design their own buildings? Or do draughtsmen do it for them? I see some wonderful houses, then there is a style and proportional nightmare like the one below, which is actually 153m3 newbuild spec home... with possibly the smallest front door in the world.

I am interested as the MIL has applied for rezoning of a bit of land and if it's successful, we will plan our house, but I don't want the to hear "My mate Janusz will do it for you" and it turns out like this.

Oh, and my step-daughter was talking about studying architecture. This might show her that not everyone considers the need for an architect.

agatka131Threads: 2 Posts: 19 Joined: Sep 16, 08 ♀	Oct 15, 11, 21:23 #2
it's definately too many windows. Maybe the house owner is a wampire :)

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Edited by: hythorn Oct 15, 11, 21:27 #3

sure as eggs is eggs all those vile boxes of houses created in the 1970s would have been designed by an architect

the new trend is to build 'English' estates and they are marketed as such
personally I would much rather live in a block

no poxy garden to have to take care of and a much lower chance of getting burgled along with the anonymity
unless it is a new block where you have some yuppie tw@ts getting some fool in to drill holes morning, night and day

you can find a house that you really like and give it to an architect to draw up, it should not be too difficult for them

SeanBMThreads: 41 Posts: 8,727 Joined: Mar 10, 08 ♂	Oct 15, 11, 21:27 #4
magpie: "My mate Janusz will do it for you" and it turns out like this. Don't pay for the plans if you are not happy with them. I see many people buy ready made plans from archonplus, it's cheap.

f stopThreads: 33 Posts: 2,861 Joined: Dec 9, 09 ♀	Oct 16, 11, 00:02 #5
Hope he was not a landscaper as well. ;)

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Edited by: magpie Oct 16, 11, 00:05 #6

I was at my SIL's block in Lodz yesterday and had a nap in their salon-bedroom, pressumably while they sat in their closet-kitchen. When I woke up I could hear the next door neighbours arguing. It was like a friggin Ken Loach film and I couldn't get out of their fast enough. Christ it was depressing. Modern Flats are different and I quite like them, but I still prefer a detached house, or semi.

In fact, my idea is to build twins and sell the other 1/2. Something like this:

http://www.archonplus.com/house-plans/m473427302e1f3/1076/house-in-the -irises-3-t.html

I wonder how the 2,250 zł for the plans compares to paying the local Janusz-archi-draughtsman? I'd best ask one of the Mrs' cousins. One of them is actually an enormous moustache with a man attached to it, so he's probably the best one to ask.

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Oct 16, 11, 01:31 #7

There is something that I just dont get about Polish houses.

To me a dining table should be in a dining room which is near the kitchen (in a separate room) or within the kitchen itself (if it is large enough).
I just do not get having a dining room table slap bang in the middle of a lounge...and also I can't quite get having a washing machine in the bathroom.
Strange how different people perceive how a house should be constructed.

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Oct 16, 11, 01:40 #8

terri:

and also I can't quite get having a washing machine in the bathroom.
Strange how different people perceive how a house should be constructed.

pretty practical simply - most bathrooms are all tiles (on the floor) or at least they have a general drain somewhere in the (concrete) floor (the lowest point) - if anything happens to the washing machine the water just goes down the drain - if you have to take soaked clothes out of the washing machine you just chuck'em into the bathtub

pgtxThreads: 49 Posts: 6,327 Joined: Feb 14, 09 MEMBER ♀	Edited by: pgtx Oct 16, 11, 01:44 #9
Designed by Robert Konieczny. Located in Warszawa.

beckskiThreads: 19 Posts: 2,148 Joined: May 15, 07 MEMBER ♀	Edited by: beckski Oct 16, 11, 03:02 #10
I've never seen a home before, with it's own personal drive-in theater. I guess the Konieczny house has everything. A sincere thanks PF, for putting up with me FIVE terrific years, muah!

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Oct 16, 11, 08:22 #11

architects in Poland have tunnel vision- they all do the same thing. If they are schooled in Poland it is evident. If they are schooled outside of Poland or work with somebody schooled outside of Poland- these people have clearer vision.
Many people will buy from the pre made plans- there are a few books in empik that have them. the plans all look the same- they are quite basic. nice house but nothing interesting.
where I live in Warsaw there are a few people that have built duplexes but the second side hasn't sold for over two years.
I wouldn't do it. what happens if you get a neighbour that you don't like?

In fact, my idea is to build twins and sell the other 1/2. Something like this:

http://www.archonplus.com/house-plans/m473427302e1f3/1076/house-in-the -irises-3-t.html

I wonder how the 2,250 zł for the plans compares to paying the local Janusz-archi-draughtsman? I'd best ask one of the Mrs' cousins. One of them is actually an enormous moustache with a man attached to it, so he's probably the best one to ask.

Those plans are really quite nice and comparable to many of works that I have seen by architects- maybe that is why they cost more.

as for the dining room in the main room, that is personal preference- I have an open plan in my house- I prefer it. our kitchen, dining and living room are all one open space- this is why they bought the house.

I also put my washing machine in my bedroom. I took out a bathroom that was a useless size, installed wall to wall closets and put my washer and dryer inside so I don't have to lug laundry up and down the stairs- and we have more space in our main bathroom.

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Edited by: magpie Oct 16, 11, 10:32 #12

pgtx:

Designed by Robert Konieczny. Located in Warszawa.

To me, that house is amazingly visionary and absolutely revolting at the same time. The first time I saw it I thought it was some mental Texan oil billionaire (or multi-millionaire if you are able to count) stockbroker type.

It's sort of Miami Vice meets Alabama-redneck-apocalypse-obsessed-paranoiac. I can hear banjos AND piano accordions.

pipThreads: 11 Posts: 1,293 Joined: Jul 4, 11 ♀	Oct 16, 11, 12:26 #13
magpie: To me, that house is amazingly visionary and absolutely revolting at the same time. The first time I saw it I thought it was some mental Texan oil billionaire (or multi-millionaire if you are able to count) stockbroker type. have you seen some of the houses in Poland? proves to show that money and good taste have nothing in common.

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Oct 16, 11, 12:45 #14

pip:

have you seen some of the houses in Poland?

I know what you mean. I've also noticed that even in quite modest homes that you can never have too many colours in the same room either.

When I say to her friends that some houses (and shop fronts/billboards/reklama/choices of paint colours in the one room/permed hair etc) are completely over the top, I can see that some people think I must have no sense of taste or be from an underprivileged background.

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Oct 16, 11, 13:28 #15

magpie:

When I say to her friends that some houses (and shop fronts/billboards/reklama/choices of paint colours in the one room/permed hair etc) are completely over the top, I can see that some people think I must have no sense of taste or be from an underprivileged background.

that is pretty accurate! However, what I have noticed is that those that come from more humble working class back grounds but now have money- are the ones that have quite garish taste. (not always but frequently)

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Edited by: magpie Oct 16, 11, 16:11 #16

pip:

...from more humble working class back grounds but now have money- are the ones that have quite garish taste. (not always but frequently)

That could be true for any nationality, but for here and now it's mega true, but not only here. I know a guy in London who works with bronze, restoring statues, memorials etc. Lots of work with English Heritage etc. A good earner for him are the nouveau rich Russians whom he will make stuff like a pedestal for a bit of art work at £20,000 each. That's the cost of the pedestal, not the art work. But he reckons it could be MDF painted to look like metal. One Russian client of his has an indoor swimming, the surface is completely finished in real gold, which as a true craftsman, he refers to as "Tacky as f'ck".

The interesting thing for me is that I told Mrs Magpie about something I heard about the wedding of Posh and Becks and how they had enormous tacky his'n'her gold painted thrones at their wedding reception: The lower the education, the greater the celebration. The word 'education' can be interpreted as life experience or various other words I guess.

I showed her kitchens like these and in general, she could see what I meant.

For example, like it or not, these are upmarket kitchens:

Whereas these simply cost a lot of money:

"Dodatkowo oryginalny design foteli do siedzenia doskonale koresponduje z kuchennym designer całości."

"Różowe dodatki podkreślone różowymi elementem ściany nadają życia całości , ocieplają atmosferę tego pomieszczenia. Dzięki temu kuchnia nie sprawia wrażenia całkowicie patetycznej i surowej."

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Oct 16, 11, 18:38 #17

I think polish architecture related to "houses" is not so interesting unless any architect will make something different in the style like the house from Robert Konieczny where is possible to apply a concept and develop this until getting a product that is not common and could appear in any architectonical magazine as happens with houses from other countries and mostly from USA. In my opinion there are many reasons for this situation and why is for now in this way. Some of them maybe are related to the not big architectonical development during communist time, as people just got what they needed. But after this came all new and now new things are being done. Also there are many old houses and neighborhoods that dont renovate as polish society doesnt have such need in comparison to other societies in the world where they need more new buildings for people. About designs, in last time i see that there are some changes....new modern buildings appearing everywhere but not much in the "houses" field. About apartments I think i have seen some interesting things at least that show Poland is moving forward to new modern architecture (like Sea Towers, maybe some people dont like but at least is something different), but still is necessary to do more. I believe that where architects can make the difference is innovating...because if not, as someone else posted....in the future could be enough to buy plans of something already designed. And adding to this it doesnt depend only in architect (to try to innovate) also in society, so i just hope architects could still have a job now and later :)

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Oct 16, 11, 19:12 #18

Yes, you make good points, but the problem is that nothing is new (e.g. the Sea Towers = Malaysia's Petronas Towers from 1998) and if people have a normal job and can afford a normal mortgage, then probably only want a normal house, so buying a plan from a website makes sense.

And especially with architecture, if you compare it to fashion or say hairstyles is that once the novelty of flared jeans or blue hair wears off (i.e. stops being modern) you can throw them in the bin, or get your usual hairstyle again. As an extreme example, it's a little difficult after you've spent $20,000,000,000 on garish buildings such as in the eyesore that is Dubai.

I saw one of these pics a while ago and thought it was some teenage boy fantasising about Metropolis or something. All of them are modern and unique (unless you look at the one next door to it) but is anyone really better off for it, other than the agents who sold them?

http://www.realtyna.com/dubai_real_estate/dubai-future-projects.html

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Oct 16, 11, 19:18 #19

sea towers are amazing. but they are also in gdynia and make sense in gdynia. if you were to do something like this in krakow or poznan it would stick out like a sore thumb.
the housing in the rest of europe is usually set by standards. for example in france builders all need to have the terra cotta roofs. many may argue that it is too restrictive- i happen to like it, it compliments the existing style of housing.
in poland there is so much mish mash of styles that it is confusing and out of place. i think city planners have made huge mistakes in letting developers build what they want because now it is visual mess.

f stopThreads: 33 Posts: 2,861 Joined: Dec 9, 09 ♀	Oct 16, 11, 19:19 #20
Incidently, I've been shopping around for an architect in the central Florida area. Any Polish-born architects around here?

beckskiThreads: 19 Posts: 2,148 Joined: May 15, 07 MEMBER ♀	Oct 17, 11, 01:08 #21
magpie: Whereas these simply cost a lot of money: Some of the designs look like that of a cocktail lounge. A sincere thanks PF, for putting up with me FIVE terrific years, muah!

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Oct 17, 11, 10:52 #22

Well. Thanks for some answers to my points. I would like to say that I am not trying to make any rule :D just to say my opinion. Its sure that in other countries with different situations we can have "other types of modern architecture" and the situation is also different. I could mention that in my country until some years ago the most popular standard was to have a house - including the land. As result people like my grandfather who didnt have any well paid salary was able to make a house in 2 levels about 120 m2. Also in the society where I lived many conditions caused this, as the economy is not the same as in Europe, lack of urban planning and spontaneous growing in the city during more than 50 years. Recently the apartment's business is going on and specially your people is accessing to new flats... some of them with good designs, others copied architecture, and other simple blocks like from any polish neighborhood done during 70's. So i have seen lots of qualities and types coexisting in the same city. Anyway comparing now with a wealthy society as in Dubai, where all the money from the oil controls everything.... designs and architecture are for sure in another level. And yes city-planners have some influence... but architects in my opinion, should convince them of "making something better" so its some our fault not to change this wit a wise method.
Btw, i would like to show a video - animated and funny - that explains how the boom of construction happened in Spain - and also the problems that this caused because their own economical situation. The problem is that is in spanish so dont know if everybody will understand but try as graphics are very explicit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jG96g-5Pd0
Hope similar problems wont happen with the boom in construction in my country or in Poland :D at least people is still having a job.

magpieThreads: 7 Posts: 171 Joined: Mar 10, 09 ♂	Oct 17, 11, 12:35 #23
beckski: Some of the designs look like that of a cocktail lounge. That's putting it politely. Elioug, The video is great and made sense in general. :)

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Oct 17, 11, 17:17 #24

It is not about architects but the investors . Polish architects are well trained and are visionary .

But if an investor wants to direct a work of a profesional then we have a work of an amateur and the outcome can be rather kitschy .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basilica_of_Our_Lady_of_Liche%C5%84

As opposite to this

I deliberately have chosen examples of sacral architecture to show that it can be both visionary and modern .

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Oct 17, 11, 17:42 #25

I can see the dome of that church in the video if I look out my window. It is hideous. There is no visionary- it is an ugly tacky display of architecture that doesn't fit with the surroundings- but that is warsaw- nothing works with each other.

I disagree that Polish architects are visionaries. Strongly disagree.

http://www.fortis.com.pl/realizacje/obiekty_biurowe/canal_plus/17/

recognize this? it is the canal plus building in warsaw. I have been inside this building. It is even tackier than the outside. My husband is in commercial real estate so I have seen a lot of buildings that the average person hasn't. Some buildings are nice but some are not.
as for interior designers- they are also a joke, unless you want your house or flat finished in chocolate brown and white- then all is good.
I had a client who told me she viewed 40 flats looking for something to rent and they all looked the same.

hythornThreads: 6 Posts: 843 Joined: Feb 21, 08 ♂	Oct 17, 11, 17:51 #26
pip: I disagree that Polish architects are visionaries. Strongly disagree. some of them are good I read about an architect's office from Poznan where they won awards for Poznan airport, Stary Browar and the Targi building (the one that does not look like a bloomin space rocket)

magpieThreads: 7 Posts: 171 Joined: Mar 10, 09 ♂	Oct 17, 11, 17:54 #27
Visionary? The Chinese were visionary in advance of the Olympics too: Doesn't mean it isn't crap. Actually, like the drawings of potential Dubai crap, its all quite adolescent really, in a "look at us, we're your equal" kind of way. And like I said earlier, nothing is new, it just depends how it's presented.

pipThreads: 11 Posts: 1,293 Joined: Jul 4, 11 ♀	Oct 17, 11, 18:39 #28
hythorn: some of them are good yes, some are good. you are right stary browar in Poznan is super. Unfortunately architects like this are few and far between.

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Oct 18, 11, 19:43 #29

pip:

I disagree that Polish architects are visionaries. Strongly disagree.

you're quite wrong here, the decision on how a building ends up looking is entirely the investors, NOT the architects. and in instances where the project is aimed at adapting an old building into something new, well, poles do it quite well. i would say, however, that interior design is an entirely different matter and still needs a few years of work..

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Oct 18, 11, 21:18 #30

pantsless:

you're quite wrong here, the decision on how a building ends up looking is entirely the investors, NOT the architects. and in instances where the project is aimed at adapting an old building into something new, well, poles do it quite well. i would say, however, that interior design is an entirely different matter and still needs a few years of work..

I am fully aware how the process goes. So what you are saying is that investors design the buildings? Don't think so. So all the architects that put offers in when a new building is being constructed don't mind if their designs are changed. sorry- don't think so.

so when Sir Norman Foster designed the gherkin, the sony centre in berlin, hearst tower in nyc or the metropolitan in Warsaw- he didn't give a rats ass about the finishes in the common areas?- it was the investors who decided? seriously?

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