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Foreign investor, properties in Poland, walk away from mortgages?


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peterwegThreads: 35
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Joined: Feb 16, 07
 Dec 22, 11, 12:05    #151
mglaze

How are you getting on?

SurferThreads: -
Posts: 1
Joined: Jan 15, 12
 Jan 15, 12, 23:58    #152
I would like to know how did you approach the situation.
I can imagine that a lot of People in Poland have very similar problem. I do not think that the initial 1800zl did go up to 3600zl. I have started to pay about 2300zl and it came up to 2800zl, I am not sure why , because my father is taking care of my investment and looks like even though the value of zloty came down a lot the LIBOR or some other interest came down.
I agree with you completely that banks have a big problem, not only banks but Polish government as well, if what you are saying were true people would not be able to cover the bills and with so many mordgages the whole economy of poland would loose.

I do not even follow it precisely but know that the very high payments lasted for one or two months, Polish people are use to this, there have been problem of inflation and all other unstable problems throughout history so i would think a lot of people do not want to give up the apartments or hoses, firstly because there is no possibility of bankruptcy.

To sum up.
Today you have a loan the is twice and high as the value of your house or apartment.
In a matter of one year or two or let's say three years Polish zloty can get stronger let's say 2.5 for Swiss , I know that this seems very unlikely but in reality it is possible.In this case you are almost even. In todays world does not matter if you are in California, Florida or London the economy is slow and especially real estate that has been bought in 2007 does not look good.

I think this is all BS and if I could i would leave the mordgage today, unfortunately in Poland there is no way to get rid of this loan and there are a lot, I mean a lot of people in the same position.

I am actually looking for someone that would help me to get out of this loan but from the experience i know that the best option is just wait and hope that things will turn around.

Poles are very interesting when you ask average Pole how much do you make a month they tell you 2000zl is average, 3000 zl is pretty good but they drive 100 000zl cars and this is the average car. The same goes to mordgage payments even though the payments go up 40% for some reason they will pay it, in stead of go out on the street and say hej, this is pure BS we got the loan but something is wrong we do not want to pay it this high.

I do not know, investments are like this, it would be sweet if you could take a loan send couple hundreds pounds for several years and then cash out , this happens but not always this is part of investing, and now we are simply loosing.
Grzegorz_Threads: 81
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 Jan 16, 12, 01:37    #153
Surfer:
I think this is all BS and if I could i would leave the mordgage today, unfortunately in Poland there is no way to get rid of this loan


Why "unfortunately" ?

Surfer:
The same goes to mordgage payments even though the payments go up 40% for some reason they will pay it, in stead of go out on the street and say hej, this is pure BS we got the loan but something is wrong we do not want to pay it this high.


LOL ! What do you think then would happen with this debt ? Would it disappear ? No really, someone else would have to pay it back. Please tell me why others should pay back debts, which are not their own ?
wielki panThreads: 3
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 Jan 16, 12, 02:51    #154
Surfer:
Today you have a loan the is twice and high as the value of your house or apartment



Who has given you advice about the value of your apartment? first time I've come across somebody in this situation. Where is your property?
Grzegorz_Threads: 81
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 Jan 16, 12, 05:41    #155
It's much more about changes in currency exchange rates than the value of property itself.
Wroclaw BoyThreads: 57
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 Jan 16, 12, 09:59    #156
Grzegorz_:
Please tell me why others should pay back debts, which are not their own ?

because we didnt ask for the system as it is, it was forced upon us, because the government have the authority to bail out banks for billions using OUR TAX money, if the government does it (pay debts which are not their own) why cant we?
hythornThreads: 6
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 Jan 16, 12, 10:08    #157
wielki pan:
Who has given you advice about the value of your apartment? first time I've come across somebody in this situation. Where is your property?


what I think he means is if you take out a mortgage on a 100,000 euro property, you will have to pay back 200,000 euros over the life of the mortgage

it is normal however it gives you the advantage of having somewhere to live whilst you pay off the mortgage :-)

it is not clear though
Wroclaw BoyThreads: 57
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 Jan 16, 12, 11:05    #158
hythorn:

what I think he means is if you take out a mortgage on a 100,000 euro property, you will have to pay back 200,000 euros over the life of the mortgage

No what he means is that if you take a loan in CHF but pay back in PLN, and then the exchange rate changes against the PLN (which it has done) then not only are you dealing with high interest payments and a deflating property bubble, but you also have a CHF loan which is 30% more expensive than when you signed up.
milkyThreads: 10
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Joined: Oct 26, 09
 Jan 16, 12, 12:38    #159
Grzegorz_:
The same goes to mordgage payments even though the payments go up 40% for some reason they will pay it, in stead of go out on the street and say hej, this is pure BS we got the loan but something is wrong we do not want to pay it this high.

I reckon no matter how bad things get, the Poles would be the last people in Europe to protest (unless it over a cross or something holy).
AvalonThreads: 3
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 Jan 16, 12, 15:18    #160
milky:

I reckon no matter how bad things get, the Poles would be the last people in Europe to protest (unless it over a cross or something holy).


Are you forgetting the protests against food shortages and communism or are these other little facts that you like to leave out of your posts.
delphiandomineThreads: 42
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 Jan 16, 12, 15:20    #161
Avalon:
Are you forgetting the protests against food shortages and communism or are these other little facts that you like to leave out of your posts.


Mark likes the idea of communism, remember - he would be first in line for his state-subsidised flat.
MidasThreads: 2
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Edited by: Midas  Jan 16, 12, 18:58    #162
LOL ! What do you think then would happen with this debt ? Would it disappear ? No really, someone else would have to pay it back. Please tell me why others should pay back debts, which are not their own ?

Americans are used to solving the issues that are connected with mortgages that are "under the water" ( price of property < amount of credit ) by way of mailing the deed and the keys to the house to the bank and walking away from the deal.

I wouldn't be surprised if U.S. courts actually approved of that solution, based on the idea that in every credit deal the bank is the stronger party ( a legal notion that is completely alien for Eastern European courts and judges ).

I am actually looking for someone that would help me to get out of this loan

Read what I wrote earlier. Not going to happen.

Are you forgetting the protests against food shortages and communism or are these other little facts that you like to leave out of your posts.

Polish people and people in Eastern Europe in general are VERY unlikely to mass-protest, it was really a lot of work put in by the Reagan administration back in the 1980's that they went on mass strikes and ultimately brought down communism.
Grzegorz_Threads: 81
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 Jan 16, 12, 20:32    #163
Midas:

Americans are used to solving the issues that are connected with mortgages that are "under the water" ( price of property < amount of credit ) by way of mailing the deed and the keys to the house to the bank and walking away from the deal.


And that's one of the main reasons why all this mess around the world has stared... Debt doesn't disappear then... Others have to pay it back... If not through government's bail outs then through general higher cost of debt.
AvalonThreads: 3
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 Jan 16, 12, 21:10    #164
Midas:

Polish people and people in Eastern Europe in general are VERY unlikely to mass-protest, it was really a lot of work put in by the Reagan administration back in the 1980's that they went on mass strikes and ultimately brought down communism.


So those are street parties in Romania and Slovakia?
MidasThreads: 2
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 Jan 16, 12, 21:17    #165
So those are street parties in Romania and Slovakia?

How much are they likely to influence the goverments in any way?

You can protest all you want in the Ukraine or Russia, things just won't change. So people in Eastern Europe don't protest as often as others.
milkyThreads: 10
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 Jan 16, 12, 22:50    #166
Avalon:
it was really a lot of work put in by the Reagan administration back in the 1980's that they went on mass strikes and ultimately brought down communism.

my point exactly,then again ,the boys are admitted Thatcherites.
southernThreads: 116
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Edited by: southern  Jan 17, 12, 16:31    #167
There was probably a secret agreement handle power to civil parties and there will be amnesty for your crimes.The only presidents who refused to obey were Ceausescu and Milosevic and they were delivered exemplary death.
milkyThreads: 10
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 Jan 17, 12, 22:32    #168
Midas:
Lol, compared to what's been going on in Eastern Europe it is a shining beacon of democracy :-)


no, just the same system of markets dictate. Democracy, is well dead now.
HarryThreads: 62
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[Suspended]
 Jan 17, 12, 22:49    #169
" just the same system of markets dictate."
The markets do indeed dictate that those who can't be bothered to get a job will never own their home (a good thing, they'd only expect the taxpayer top pay for the upkeep thereof).
lodz161Threads: 1
Posts: 1
Joined: May 23, 12
 May 23, 12, 15:55    #170
Man when i did everyone become banker's mouthpiece's, the banks lent the money, they also can lose and should, creating and lending money is not a one-way street to endless profit. Anyone who can walk away from an underwater mortgage should, banks need to learn lessons too,
If you have few assets the banks will not waste their time chasing you, lawyers cost money. Play the game, but play it better.
The banks put their hands out when they need to be bailed out and no mater how much right wing, moral bulls*** people here say, they will force governments to bail them out.
Is'nt it funny that banks create huge problems and then get all the ignorant self-interested people to fight there moral arguments,
milkyThreads: 10
Posts: 1,229
Joined: Oct 26, 09
 May 23, 12, 21:59    #171
lodz161:
Is'nt it funny that banks create huge problems and then get all the ignorant self-interested people to fight there moral arguments,



yea ,,,no shortage of idiots. However, some are payed to fight the banks moral argument.
cmsThreads: 6
Posts: 201
Joined: Sep 4, 09
 May 24, 12, 06:19    #172
Ok as long as you never want to borrow money for anything again. If you might ever like a loan for your kids college or a car to get to work suggest you don't walk away but come to some kind of settlement
Foreigner4Threads: 22
Posts: 1,990
Joined: Nov 18, 07
 May 24, 12, 08:26    #173
lodz161:
the banks lent the money, they also can lose and should, creating and lending money is not a one-way street to endless profit. Anyone who can walk away from an underwater mortgage should, banks need to learn lessons too, If you have few assets the banks will not waste their time chasing you, lawyers cost money. Play the game, but play it better. The banks put their hands out when they need to be bailed out and no mater how much right wing, moral bulls*** people here say, they will force governments to bail them out. Is'nt it funny that banks create huge problems and then get all the ignorant self-interested people to fight there moral arguments,

I cannot remember a time when I have read so much truth on such a complex matter in so few words.
This is one of the best posts on this forum I have read.
MidasThreads: 2
Posts: 788
Joined: Jul 19, 10
 May 24, 12, 19:51    #174
Man when i did everyone become banker's mouthpiece's, the banks lent the money, they also can lose and should, creating and lending money is not a one-way street to endless profit. Anyone who can walk away from an underwater mortgage should, banks need to learn lessons too,
If you have few assets the banks will not waste their time chasing you, lawyers cost money. Play the game, but play it better.
The banks put their hands out when they need to be bailed out and no mater how much right wing, moral bulls*** people here say, they will force governments to bail them out.
Is'nt it funny that banks create huge problems and then get all the ignorant self-interested people to fight there moral arguments,

Coulda, woulda, shoulda...

I was labouring under the impression that we were actually taking into account how the currently binding Polish civil law works regarding debts, obligations, mortgage-secured credit and so forth and not talking how things should be.

Under the currently binding Polish legal statutes a credit obligation is still a personal obligation regardless of the mortgage. Thus the bank can ( and frequently - will ) pursue all available forms of recover, which often means wage garnishment, going after other property of the debtor and so forth.


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