Poland's apartment prices continue to fall

that wasn't very polite, was it ?


are wages not going up ?


developers don't sell according to nationality. they just sell. one can't blame them for taking advantage.

new flats these days are the walk in type. meaning no corridor/hall. they also have kitchen-livingroom combined, which gives a greater usable floor area. the flats are still small, cost less to build, and most importantly, not dropping in price. at least here in wroclaw.

the only thing that will bring prices down is the banks when they stop offering credit, because clients can't afford the repayments. no sign of that here in wroclaw.

You my son are living in a dream world! I have read your tosh on this forum for so long now you are like a broken record and not one thing you have predicted has ever come true. In ten years time you will still be claiming that there is this big bubble and you still won't own a property, sorry to say but you are really boring mate.

In the West??hell no.


I agree


yes they are..How much are the Golden members paying for those lies??
Warsaw's average apartment price is down 10% from the peak of Q2 2008, but in Wroclaw prices are 30% down, in Poznan 25% down, and in the Tri-City of Gdansk, Sopot and Gdynia, prices are 22% below their peaks.

globalpropertyguide.com/Europe/Poland/Price-History


Sorry, am I suppose to make you happy??

No, did I say you were?

Just out of interest how much are you hoping/claiming the property prices are going to fall within the next few years? And do you think you will be able to afford to buy when they hit this level that only you seem to believe in? Have you ever owned property anywhere?

More lies.

Poznan is about 8-10% down from the all-time high for older blocks (for example, Rataje/Jezyce/Piatkowo). The newer blocks haven't budged at all - in fact, they seem to still be rising.


That link is nearly a year out of date and shows that house prices climbed massively and only fell back a short way.

Mark, buying a property in Poland is the same as everywhere else. You work, along with your partner, and then you can afford a house. Simple.

Exactly - all these figures are broad-brush and make no distinction on the basis of property type. Wielka plyta has been on the way down since around 2005, not because of a collapse in the market, but because there's better property available. If in a given month the majority of sales are in wielka plyta, of course prices will appear to go down.

See statistics 101 - sampling error.

PS agree that prices have gone down - but 25%? Nah, sorry.

Mark does not state facts, just wishes.

There are sources out there, suggesting a further weakening of the market.

poland-vacations.com/174/2011-0169/poland-estates-en.html

It's more that the market has refocused. A couple of years back people were building stupidly expensive stuff and it was flying out as fast as they could knock it up but now developers are focusing more on affordable properties and smaller sizes. I'd expect to see below inflation growth in prices in most cities this year but number of sales going up by a larger percentage than the increase in price.

Just read the link you posted but cannot say that just because there is less demand for properties already on the market, that this is a reason for a decline in prices. 95% of the properties advertised are rubbish, overpriced and would find it difficult to sell at even cheap prices.

When I first came to Poland in 2002, I was going to build my own house (being a builder for 30 years it would be easy) but continually got messed around when trying to buy a decent plot of land, I would agree a price for the land, get planning permission and then the landowner wanted more money because his friends and family thought it was worth more. (This happened a couple of times and wasted months of my time)

Anyway, after 2 years of this crap, I started looking for a house to buy as I was not getting any younger. I started looking in earnest for a place for a further two years but could not find anything that I liked, then I found out a new baby was on the way and really panicked, had to look further out of the town than I had before but managed to find my semi-perfect house by accident, there was a "For Sale" sign on the gate. The couple who lived in/built the house had spent 3 years in the UK when they graduated from university, so, the build was more or less of an English design and quality.

When somebody buys a flat/apartment, they know that all the rest of the building is roughly the same, quality wise. An individual house is something different, it has to feel right, it has to meet the criteria for growing kids and for when you get older and cannot manage the stairs etc. A house is a long term project, even the way you landscape the gardens is a statement of your own personality and is carried out over many years. I know in my heart that if I had bought any of the houses that I had previously viewed, I would have ended up demolishing them and starting from scratch as I would never have been happy.

Sorry this was a bit long but wanted you to know from a personal experience how hard it is to find the right place.

Avalon, I have had my fair share of wasted time, while in the process of buying property in Poland, so I understand you entirely,
Just as an odd on to your house hunting account in PL. The house can always be restructured to suit your needs 95%, although the plot is what it is, of course you can landscape and plant trees, location is still location though.


This is my practice as well, walk around an area and spot the for sale signs and contact sellers direct. If I was a freshman in PL, in this day and age, purely because of the availability/glut in certain areas, I would consider renting for six months, research and identify. There is quite a bit of crud out there, especially houses built in the 90's(cheap materials)


Absolutely, so this is the reason the banks have adjusted their lending policy.

Very good points.

In other words, falling real prices.

Yes, falling real prices in general but not falling prices in general.

However, with that said some sectors will be seeing growth and others will see falling prices. The mid-market (5,000zl/sqm in cities like Szczecin) mid-size market is where I'd expect to see above interest growth and the market for large-size luxury flats is going to see further falls.

Frankly, if you're looking to invest right now, keep your money in the bank: you can get 7% with no risk at all.

According to a developer, I have known for many years in Warsaw, they have just completed on a plot in Mokotow in a fantastic location and they will start to offer to the general public in 3 months if they have not sold out already. They will build 18 apartments 100-200 m2 (according to him that is what the market requires) price will be 20-28,000 PLN per m2. Also look at Residence Opera phase 2 ( dom deveopments) apartments 100- 180 m2 sold out. Bonifraterska 8, 14 apartments, sold out. The market for apartments of 120=-300 m2 is very strong in the center, Mokotow and Zoliborz, because of the high prices of houses.

Warsaw is very different to the rest of Poland.

Its an excellent interest rate, UK savers should take note, and the Zloty looks strong.

Gonna get stronger now the central bank has no alternative but to raise interest rates again on latest inflation figures. (Not in the near term, because that's a bad sign, but it'll correct). Fill yer boots!

How much would this house be in Poland??????????
daft.ie/searchsale.daft?id=563833
similar price Poland
rew1.com/en/Sale-House/semi-detached_house/Poland/Lublin_voivodeship/Lublin/1396896
average industrial wage Ireland 35000 Euro
Poland 7000 Euro
Minimum wage Poland 2 euro
and hour
Ireland 8 euro
hahahah

Quote

How much would this house be in Poland??????????

Mark, anyone can use stupid examples.

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2004295/Quaint-700k-thatched-cottages-sit-afford-them.html


You really are a fool.

sorry Thatcherite,wake up from your economic wet dream and smell the truth..
ronanlyons.com/2009/02/04/public-sector-pay-in-ireland-the-e50000-question-its-not-that-difficult/


Ok, you use one so, Mr ........., to prove me wrong!!

Thing is Mark, we work and work hard, that is why a comfortable life in our own home is not just a dream for us. Why not try working sometime?

You all seem to know who Milky is, but I don't. Can you enlighten me?

As for people talking about real estate in Poland on PF, there are the usual suspects with their own views of the market (I am one of them)good or bad. On the issue of Milky v Mark Biernet, I have to say that Milky comes across as an Irish fella and: linkedin.com/pub/mark-biernat/6/400/465 states he is from the states. So I am missing something here...

No you are not, the guys are snarking.

Basically he's pointing out that Polish house prices are vastly over inflated compared to wages, which is true. He's fighting a losing battle against the predictable Vested Interest's who use the 'its different this time', 'special case', 'jealousy' arguments with a large dose of person insults to hide their fears/hopes.

big time..creating a distraction from the real issue. They will attack any minute now lol

hey WB, do you know if Americans can buy properties in Poland? I have a bet going here and I'm trying to win $50.00. (I hope I'm right :-)

Over on this forum, the bulls have gone very quiet lately housepricecrash.co.uk

I am seeing quite a few for sale banners and signs outside older apartments in Poland, as well as big signs outside the new blocks.

And as an outsider admittedly, still have observed the price per square meter in the cities here seems well out of step with average salaries, leading me to suspect high multiple mortgages are being loaned, high deposit values from families (or Bank of Mum & Dad as it's called in the UK) are being given, or foreign money is buying. High multiples and bad mortgage debts have huge dangers - some of you PMd me to say that Polish banks are very careful. If they turn out to not have been so careful, will the Polish central bank do a Mervyn King and slash rates to 0.5% and say to hell with inflation as they have in Britain, pretty much? I just wonder if Poland really is doing so well or is living in lala land like Eire was.

Blue touch paper lit I suppose, but had to get it off my chest.

globalpost.com/dispatch/poland/110204/poland-economy-public-debt

From this article:

Poland's lucky streak has ended as it grapples with rising public debt and a stubbornly high budget deficit - while continuing to borrow money abroad.

OK

a Polish factory worker still makes about a fifth that of his German counterpart for essentially the same work.
OK

Real estate prices have settled down. The average price of apartments dropped by about 10 percent in 2009, a reaction to the collapse of real estate markets in western Europe and to the fact that average prices for a square meter of living space had soared above $3,000, putting housing out of reach for many average earners. However, since then the price falls have stopped, and buyers are beginning to return, helped by a government program aimed at helping poorer families buy their first apartment.

Is this 'government program' (Government/Developer scam)not just collusion with developers and their hyper inflated prices? Why not allow prices to settle naturally? and should the government be spending money to help developers?

"We're starting to see some life come back into the market. The crisis is definitely over for the sector," said Kazimierz Kirejczyk, head of the Reas property consultancy.

LOL....
youtube.com/watch?v=M_AZBQEvhYc&feature=related

No: it is cheaper to help people to house themselves than it is to provide housing for them.


Prices are settling naturally: the scheme which you mention above is for the low-end of the market (i.e. the one which has seen growth all the way through the crisis).

Naturally, the prices are still out of your reach, but that is more a comment on you and your refusal to get a real job than about the price of property in Poland.

It's funny how the hard core advocates of the free-market economy, deplore(ideologically) religiously, any governmental interference with the markets; unless it's 'interference', that benits "them".