can you get polish citizenship through marriage outside of Poland?

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May 24, 10, 01:27 #1

Hello, I'm a Polish girl with an Australian boyfriend. We are living together and I'm about to apply for the de facto visa, but recently we started to discussing other options, like going together to England. And here is my question? If he marry me, and we will live together in England, how can he get EU and Polish benefits? Australians can stay and work in UK for max 2 years but we want to move there permanently,you know get married and have kids ect :))) so he will need a work permit or something to be able to work in EU when his visa finishes. As a Polish citizen he could work there with no problems.

thank you for any info or advice.

RevokeNiceThreads: 21 Posts: 2,767 Joined: Jun 20, 09 ♂	May 24, 10, 01:35 #2
Before I post up EU directives, you are moving to the UK as in England, yes? :)

nincompoop_notThreads: 4 Posts: 229 Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♀	May 24, 10, 01:42 #3
when he gets Polish permanent residency after 3 years of being married to you and living in Poland - then he'll be free to be in the UK on the same terms as you here's info in Polish http://e-prawnik.pl/domowy/prawo-administracyjne-1/dla-cudzoziemca-1/a rtykuly/jak-zostac-rezydentem-dlugoterminowym-wspolnoty.html not sure what kind of benefits you have in mind? and why benefits?

zuczekThreads: 4 Posts: 165 Joined: May 10, 10 ♂	Edited by: zuczek May 24, 10, 01:43 #4
It used to be 5 years of marriage and residing in Poland. Has it been changed to 3? I just glanced at the first page of your link and saw 5 years mentioned but not 3.

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May 24, 10, 01:45 #5

nincompoop_not:

then he'll be free to be in the UK on the same terms as you

Wrong.

(5)The right of all Union citizens to move and reside freely within the territory of the Member States should, if it is to be exercised under objective conditions of freedom and dignity, be also granted to their family members, irrespective of nationality. For the purposes of this Directive, the definition of ‘family member’ should also include the registered partner if the legislation of the host Member State treats registered partnership as equivalent to marriage.

(6)In order to maintain the unity of the family in a broader sense and without prejudice to the prohibition of discrimination on grounds of nationality, the situation of those persons who are not included in the definition of family members under this Directive, and who therefore do not enjoy an automatic right of entry and residence in the host Member State, should be examined by the host Member State on the basis of its own national legis-lation, in order to decide whether entry and residence could be granted to such persons, taking into consideration their relationship with the Union citizen or any other circumstances, such as their financial or physical dependence on the Union citizen.

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2004:229:00 35:0048:EN:PDF

richasisThreads: 5 Posts: 833 Joined: Jul 25, 09 ♂	May 24, 10, 02:00 #6
zuczek: It used to be 5 years of marriage and residing in Poland. Yes. I was under the very same understanding.

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Edited by: nincompoop_not May 24, 10, 02:23 #7

yes, 5 - wrong key

Revoke - all's fine but

The United Kingdom has also opted out of Directive 2004/58/EC on the right of citizens and their family members to move and reside freely within the territory of the Member States

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200506/ldselect/ldeucom/58/ 5808.htm

If your family members are not EEA or Swiss nationals and they are coming to live with you permanently or on a long-term basis, they will need to apply for an EEA family permit before coming to the UK. The EEA family permit is similar to a visa and is issued by visa services.

the whole UKBA section re: marriages and family members explains all
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visitingtheuk/gettingmarried/permiss iontomarryinUK/

this one explains in an easy way
http://www.easyexpat.com/en/faq/departure/q6.htm

RevokeNiceThreads: 21 Posts: 2,767 Joined: Jun 20, 09 ♂	Edited by: RevokeNice May 24, 10, 02:33 #8
nincompoop_not: Revoke - all's fine but Aha, didnt know that. EDIT- I am too tired but it seems that the speaker recommends that the UK opt out, not that they have actually opted out. I am tired, though. So I could be wrong.

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Edited by: nincompoop_not May 24, 10, 02:39 #9

that's why my other links from the UKBA site - the most current info on the rules in the UK

there are questions of course where they going to get married - Poland or UK - as different rules will apply but they can read through

ah, and questions was: can you get polish citizenship through marriage outside of Poland?

you can get married abroad but he'd have to live in Poland for 5 years to get citizenship (correct version)

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Edited by: lalacruz May 24, 10, 06:49 #10

Thank you RevokeNice and nincompoop_not for making it more clear to me.

The problem is, living in Poland for 3 years is not an option.
YES, We can get married there. But we will be living in England.

And the main think I'm trying to find out is: What's the easiest way to get my Australian partner long term work permission for England.

Is there any law that will apply for this case. A husband of Polish/EU resident is allow to work in England or not?

p.s. well, by "benefits" I meant - being able to work and live in most EU countries without visa.

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May 24, 10, 11:06 #11

it's up there on the UK Border AGency website;
if you get married and plan to come to the UK he'd have to apply for a 'family permit'

If your family members are not EEA or Swiss nationals and they are coming to live with you permanently or on a long-term basis, they will need to apply for an EEA family permit before coming to the United Kingdom. The EEA family permit is similar to a visa and is issued by Visa Services. Your family members should apply for an EEA family permit at their nearest British diplomatic post.

source: http://www.icslegal.com//europeancitizensrightsandresponsibilitiesfami lymemberswhoarenoteeaorswissnational.php
If he gets one - before coming to the UK - than he'll be able to work.

There's no short way/way around this.

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May 24, 10, 11:37 #12

lalacruz:

Is there any law that will apply for this case. A husband of Polish/EU resident is allow to work in England or not?

Firstly when you apply in the UK you should be able to prove that you are and have been a couple living together for a period of time. Maybe such as joint tenancy agreements,joint bank accounts and pictures of you both together in different locations. The problem you may find in the UK is that many Polish women/girls have been duped or paid into marrying a non EU national.

If I was in your position I would get married in Poland because you are a national of Poland and you can easily get all the documents you require if you decide to travel to the UK. But of course you will require a lot of documents from Aus so your boyfriend can get married to you in Poland. There is NO short cut and marriage should Not be considered an option for work extension.

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May 24, 10, 16:32 #13

Well I guess. If marriage is getting considered to reach to UK or staying in UK ... I dont get convinced with such decision .. on other hands if you marry him in Poland then its an easy for him to go to UK with you as you can get all the documents which you require in Poland rather its a difficult in UK.

I think Poland is a nice place so live here for 3 years and then go to UK and personally UK has nothing ... so be here :)

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May 24, 10, 16:48 #14

lalacruz:

p.s. well, by "benefits" I meant - being able to work and live in most EU countries without visa.

The general rule is that the non-EU spouse has exactly the same right of free movement and work as the EU citizen (as long as they are doing it in the same place).

A. Employment
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen is currently working for an employer. This includes vocational training programmes and some non-proprietary directors.

B. Self-employment
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen is a sole trader, in a business partnership, or is a proprietary director of a registered company.

C. Study
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen is engaged in a course of study with a qualifying educational institute or college.

D. Involuntary unemployment
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen has been employed in the State but has since become involuntarily unemployed.

E. Residing with sufficient resources
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen has sufficient resources to maintain themselves and any dependants, subject to the conditions of Regulation 2(3) and Regulation 6(2) of the Regulations.

Please note: the EU, EEA or Swiss citizen of whom you are a family member must be engaged in one or more of these activities in order for you to qualify for a residence card under their EU Treaty Rights.".

If either of you become a drain on the public purse, his resident card can be rescinded.

AmathystThreads: 30 Posts: 3,968 Joined: Nov 10, 06 ♀	May 24, 10, 21:54 #15
lalacruz: What's the easiest way to get my Australian Find out if he can apply for a British passport - if he is of British heritage, parents born here ect. You better get your skates on though, immigration rules will be changing and caps on immigration introduced.

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Edited by: lalacruz May 25, 10, 00:50 #16

nincompoop_not : Thank you very much! the "family permit" is a solution for us :) and it's definitely a shortcut from "3 years in Poland plan" :)

warszawski: We are living together already and we're both signed tenancy agreement, so that shouldn't be a problem.

Kshtriya : We are planning to get married because we want to be together (and live together in London) ,not because he wants to work in UK. That's why I'm taking my Aussie man back to Europe, so my country and family is just a short flight away :)

RevokeNice : thanks for more useful info, that actually answer my question, because I was not sure if he, as my spouse, will have the same rights :)

Amathyst : no chance for British passport :(

Thank you Guys!! looks like we are going to London!!! yeeeee

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May 25, 10, 01:23 #17

lalacruz:

Thank you Guys!! looks like we are going to London!!! yeeeee

Make sure you have sufficient funds. Your Australian spouse will be waiting for a minimum of six months for the stamp 4 visa(right to work). He will get a stamp 3 visa(permission to remain). So, you will be the bread winner for at least six months and if you become a burden on the state(i.e. claim welfare) he will find renewing stamp4/3 very difficult. Furthermore, Ireland, the UK and Denmark(what a combination) have already been brought to ECJ for failing to follow the directives(2008). Now, normally Ireland follows the UKs lead when it comes to immigration, due to the common travel area, so if Ireland is breaking the directives and *refusing to issue the non EU spouses with Stamp 4, that would lead me to believe that the Brits are or will be doing similar.

* - http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0511/1224270128873.ht ml

** - Id recommend getting an immigration lawyer before you even enter the UK, especially with a new government just after being formed. A very eurosceptic one at that.

nincompoop_notThreads: 4 Posts: 229 Joined: Nov 3, 09 ♀	Edited by: nincompoop_not May 25, 10, 02:32 #18
Lalacruz go through this check list from the UKBA http://www.ukvisas.gov.uk/en/doineedvisa/ Revoke I think that the stamps 3/4 you mentioned are specific to Ireland, and not the UK. UK rules: http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/eucitizens/applyingundereuropeanlaw/

AmathystThreads: 30 Posts: 3,968 Joined: Nov 10, 06 ♀	May 25, 10, 14:53 #19
lalacruz: Thank you Guys!! looks like we are going to London!!! yeeeee Dont want to pee on your parade, but I hope YOU have a job lined up because without the right papers your b/f wont be able to work and I can tell you now, its not a good time to come to the UK to look for work speculatively. Good though!

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May 25, 10, 18:04 #20

zuczek:

It used to be 5 years of marriage and residing in Poland. Has it been changed to 3? I just glanced at the first page of your link and saw 5 years mentioned but not 3.

It never was 5years for married couples people always misinterpret this with the normal way of gaining permanent residence without family connection. The law stipulates that after 3years of marriage and 2years of residing in Polska Permanently then one is eligible to apply for permanent residence and if PR is granted then within 6months application for Citizenship should be made. What this means is that if you were married outside the country for 3years you only need to come and reside in the country with your spouse for 2years to be eligible for PR. Word of caution though it's not as easy as it sounds as this law can be interpreted differently in all the 16 Woiwodships and the application for PR and later on Citizenship is a very complicated process that can take ages up to 2years from what i hear. If you want to know more it's always good to conduct your Woiwodship office for foreigners. Hope this will shade some light.
http://www.udsc.gov.pl/INSTRUCTION,FOR,FOREIGNERS,,704.html

ucheThreads: - Posts: 3 Joined: Dec 1, 10 ♂	Dec 2, 10, 12:51 #21
al11 u explained everything thx a lot

siddique1986	Jan 22, 12, 01:15 #22
hi, i would like to inform you that i am an asian . I have a polish girlfriend who lives in poland and now i am in france. now i dont have any valid identity is it possible to merry her in poland with my cuontries passport. please let me know.

HarryThreads: 62 Posts: 8,508 Joined: May 2, 07 ♂ [Suspended]	Jan 22, 12, 11:24 #23
" is it possible to merry her in poland with my cuontries passport." Yes, provided you are in Poland legally. So that's a no in your case.

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