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Vancouver 2010 Olympics - a socio-economic disaster



lukaszpoznanskiThreads: 19
Posts: 79
Joined: Mar 24, 08
 Feb 19, 10, 19:01    #1
It's interesting that in all the discussion of the 2010 Olympics on this forum, no one has mentioned any of the controversies concerning this year's games.

I live in Vancouver, and will point out that *a lot* of people here think hosting the 2010 games was a huge, huge mistake. On the opening day, thousands of Vancouverites poured into the streets to protest the games, which are expected to cost upwards of CAN$8,000,000,000. Yes, eight BILLION dollars.

They've spent around $900 million on security alone (!!!), essentially just militarizing the city and eroding civil liberties here. Over 1,000 surgeries have been canceled in Vancouver hospitals to pay for this, so McDonalds, Coca-Cola and the rest of the so-called "sponsors" can rake in huge profits at everyone else's expense. Vancouverites will likely spend decades paying for this event, not only in tax dollars, but also in terms of greatly diminished social services.

How would you feel if your babcia or dziadek was refused medical care because hosting a huge (and hugely wasteful, not to mention environmentally destructive) party was deemed more important? You'd probably feel disgusted, like me and thousands of other Vancouverites.

Not only that, but Vancouver has some truly appalling social crises that are being totally ignored. Google "Downtown Eastside" and you'll start to get the picture. We have the largest AIDS epidemic *in the entire developed world*, and the largest population of people suffering from intraveneous drug addiction in all of North America. Yes - even Los Angeles and New York have fewer heroin addicts. If you ever walk down East Hastings Street here, you'll probably never look at addiction and poverty the same way. It's simply heart-breaking. Imagine what $8,000,000,000 would do to alleviate these problems!

Does Vancouver's political establishment care about all this human suffering? No. They just want a huge party, no matter what the costs. They figure that more ignorant the world is about the realities of life in Vancouver, the better.

Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11
Posts: 14,563
Joined: Apr 2, 07
Edited by: Bratwurst Boy  Feb 19, 10, 19:03    #2
lukaszpoznanski:
It's interesting that in all the discussion of the 2010 Olympics on this forum, no one has mentioned any of the controversies concerning this year's games.

Bratwurst Boy:
Lotsa crashes and accidents already in Canada....bad ice problems, athletes getting hurt regularly in the pipes...bad timing during the biathlon tournaments etc.etc.etc...

Have been expecting more professional hosts!

lukaszpoznanski:
On the opening day, thousands of Vancouverites poured into the streets

It's abit long, don't you think? Why not shorten it to "Vancies"??? Or such...
lukaszpoznanskiThreads: 19
Posts: 79
Joined: Mar 24, 08
 Feb 19, 10, 19:26    #3
Bratwurst Boy:
bad ice problems, athletes getting hurt regularly in the pipes...bad timing during the biathlon tournaments etc.etc.etc...

These are not relevant controversies. That's my point. When hundreds of people are dying from AIDS, malnutrition and substance addiction, and our grandparents are being denied medical care *that their tax dollars have paid for*, who cares about "bad ice problems"?

As for "Vancouverites" being "abit [sic] long", that's what people in Vancouver are called.
Bratwurst BoyThreads: 11
Posts: 14,563
Joined: Apr 2, 07
 Feb 19, 10, 19:35    #4
lukaszpoznanski:
These are not relevant controversies.

For your olympic guests they definitely are!
RonWestThreads: 3
Posts: 165
Joined: Jan 6, 10
 Feb 19, 10, 19:55    #5
lukaszpoznanski:
They've spent around $900 million on security alone (!!!), essentially just militarizing the city and eroding civil liberties here. Over 1,000 surgeries have been canceled in Vancouver hospitals to pay for this, so McDonalds, Coca-Cola and the rest of the so-called "sponsors" can rake in huge profits at everyone else's expense. Vancouverites will likely spend decades paying for this event, not only in tax dollars, but also in terms of greatly diminished social services.

Sounds like hyperbole to me. Go hug a tree or something.
lukaszpoznanskiThreads: 19
Posts: 79
Joined: Mar 24, 08
 Feb 19, 10, 19:57    #6
RonWest:
Sounds like hyperbole to me.

Hyperbole? It's fact. Do some research smart guy.

RonWest:
Go hug a tree or something.

Are you really that morally bankrupt or just retarded?
RonWestThreads: 3
Posts: 165
Joined: Jan 6, 10
 Feb 19, 10, 20:08    #7
Every city in the world has the same problems you describe. Should we cancel all Olympics in the future and instead ask everyone to donate the money that they would have spent on the Olympics to one of these utopian causes? Let's take it to the next level, Mr. Morality. How about cancelling all public events like rock concerts, the symphony, theatre, sporting events such as hockey, basketball, etc. and take all that money to help the poor idiot who won't even lift a finger to help himself. Let's do the Obama thing, let's re-distribute wealth to the losers who suck the public tax system dry with their hands out waiting for the next welfare check so they can stock up on some more booze and drugs to get them by until the next public sustenance check rolls in.

Give me a break! People are tired of this whiny crap.
lukaszpoznanskiThreads: 19
Posts: 79
Joined: Mar 24, 08
Edited by: lukaszpoznanski  Feb 19, 10, 20:15    #8
Yeah! Screw everyone. Medical care for our grandparents is a "utopian cause"! Let's party!

RonWest:
Every city in the world has the same problems you describe.

And this is untrue. Again, Vancouver has the worst AIDS epidemic in the entire developed world. If prioritizing a huge corporate party over this kind of social crisis isn't proof of moral bankruptcy, I don't know what is.
Foreigner4Threads: 21
Posts: 1,747
Joined: Nov 18, 07
 Feb 19, 10, 20:36    #9
The level of debate RonWest has brought in would amount to me writing: Hey RonWest, go suck on an exhaust pipe!

He's saying the Olympics are causing more problems than they're solving for the locals and making a valid point that could well come to play in Poland in couple years time.
Try to imagine there are better solutions than the one you've thrown out but if you can't, then ask yourself which is better: a utopian cause or a corrupt cause?
lukaszpoznanski:
Yeah! Screw everyone. Medical care for our grandparents is a "utopian cause"! Let's party!

Well said!
RonWestThreads: 3
Posts: 165
Joined: Jan 6, 10
 Feb 19, 10, 20:43    #10
lukaszpoznanski:
If prioritizing a huge corporate party over this kind of social crisis isn't proof of moral bankruptcy, I don't know what is.

Must be why God made it rain.lukaszpoznanski

lukaszpoznanski:
Vancouver has the worst AIDS epidemic in the entire developed world.

What, there are no condoms up there?

It's the result of all the IMMORAL LIBERAL attitudes of that city. PEOPLE ARE TIRED OF that CRAP TOO!
joepilsudskiThreads: 44
Posts: 2,521
Joined: Apr 27, 07
Pictures: 1
Edited by: joepilsudski  Feb 19, 10, 20:45    #11
lukaszpoznanski:
It's interesting that in all the discussion of the 2010 Olympics on this forum, no one has mentioned any of the controversies concerning this year's games.

I live in Vancouver, and will point out that *a lot* of people here think hosting the 2010 games was a huge, huge mistake. On the opening day, thousands of Vancouverites poured into the streets to protest the games, which are expected to cost upwards of CAN$8,000,000,000. Yes, eight BILLION dollars.

They've spent around $900 million on security alone (!!!), essentially just militarizing the city and eroding civil liberties here. Over 1,000 surgeries have been canceled in Vancouver hospitals to pay for this, so McDonalds, Coca-Cola and the rest of the so-called "sponsors" can rake in huge profits at everyone else's expense. Vancouverites will likely spend decades paying for this event, not only in tax dollars, but also in terms of greatly diminished social services.

How would you feel if your babcia or dziadek was refused medical care because hosting a huge (and hugely wasteful, not to mention environmentally destructive) party was deemed more important? You'd probably feel disgusted, like me and thousands of other Vancouverites.

Not only that, but Vancouver has some truly appalling social crises that are being totally ignored. Google "Downtown Eastside" and you'll start to get the picture. We have the largest AIDS epidemic *in the entire developed world*, and the largest population of people suffering from intraveneous drug addiction in all of North America. Yes - even Los Angeles and New York have fewer heroin addicts. If you ever walk down East Hastings Street here, you'll probably never look at addiction and poverty the same way. It's simply heart-breaking. Imagine what $8,000,000,000 would do to alleviate these problems!

Does Vancouver's political establishment care about all this human suffering? No. They just want a huge party, no matter what the costs. They figure that more ignorant the world is about the realities of life in Vancouver, the better.



You make many good points...A friend on another forum, who lives in British Columbia, has brought some of these points up for discussion over there.

Tak, Olympic Games are usually an economic disaster for the hosting cities...I believe Athens is still paying off debts from it's games, and probably China, too, although I am rather ignorant of the current tax situation in China, and assume that Communist Party paid for much of it. However, CCP makes money off the backs of Chinese people.

Benefits of Olympic Games for some cities is an increase in government investment in infra-structure, such as transportation, and a quick influx of tourist monies. Now, Vancouver already has the two 'SkyTrain' lines, plus other good transportation, so money will be saved there.

Negative effects include big debts, as many of the structures (stadiums, arenas, dormitories) built for games usually do not 'convert' well for other uses, and therefore do not make a profit, even years down the line. Some countries may be getting smarter with this construction, building structures that may be more easily 're-usable' or are attractive for sale by private investors.

Olympics are primarily a 'status' thing, showing host country is ready 'for prime time'...In the fairly recent past I believe that only the Los Angeles Summer Games, run ny Peter Ueberoth, may have broken even, or possibly made a small profit...But in LA, there were already stadiums and such in place, so 'overhead' was much lower...Winter Games are much harder to sell, as the sports do not attract th TV audience...This year, TV network expects to LOSE some $200 million televising games.

As to police state, security matters, yes, these are troublesome, and a great inconvenience to locals...Olympics are a globalist corporate affair, and, as such, corporate interests trump any 'inconvenience' of locals.

I am also aware of heroin problem, and related AIDS situation in Vancouver...This will not be discussed or made public @ games.

Is it worth it?...Perhaps there should be a binding referendum on the matter in city that has ideas for hosting games...Unfortunately, these decisions are usually made at 'top level' by big pigs.
RonWestThreads: 3
Posts: 165
Joined: Jan 6, 10
 Feb 19, 10, 20:52    #12
Foreigner4:
Hey RonWest, go suck on an exhaust pipe!

Very intellectual
Foreigner4:
then ask yourself which is better: a utopian cause or a corrupt cause?

How about reality? When will that come into play? Corruption vs Utopian? That's the world you live in? Those are the only two choices

Foreigner4:
making a valid point that could well come to play in Poland in couple years time.

Somehow I do not see Poland succumbing to the far-left liberal policies that breed these behaviors into people. Furthermore, Poland will not experience the large influx of peoples from all the world the way Vancouver has.

And finally, so what do you think? Ban the Olympics from now on and funnel those funds to crackheads, prostitutes, drunks and people practicing unsafe sex habits?
lukaszpoznanskiThreads: 19
Posts: 79
Joined: Mar 24, 08
 Feb 19, 10, 20:53    #13
joepilsudski:
Perhaps there should be a binding referendum on the matter in city that has ideas for hosting games...Unfortunately, these decisions are usually made at 'top level' by big pigs.

Exactly, and I think your referendum idea is excellent. Re: Athens, I do recall reading that their games pushed Greece's debt beyond the threshold allowed for continued EU membership, which is a dimension of the current Greek financial crisis that isn't being discussed a great deal.
Foreigner4Threads: 21
Posts: 1,747
Joined: Nov 18, 07
 Feb 19, 10, 21:01    #14
RonWest:
And finally, so what do you think? Ban the Olympics from now on and funnel those funds to crackheads, prostitutes, drunks and people practicing unsafe sex habits?

RonWest:
How about reality? When will that come into play? Corruption vs Utopian? That's the world you live in? Those are the only two choices

RonWest:
Go hug a tree or something.

Foreigner4:
The level of debate RonWest has brought in would amount to me writing: Hey RonWest, go suck on an exhaust pipe!

RonWest:
Very intellectual

if you see a pattern here, rest assured your eyes do not deceive you: you actually used the very same ill fated attempts at logical debate you've so recently attempted to criticize. Your failure is complete.
Have a nice day:)
lukaszpoznanskiThreads: 19
Posts: 79
Joined: Mar 24, 08
 Feb 19, 10, 21:10    #15
RonWest:
And finally, so what do you think? Ban the Olympics from now on and funnel those funds to crackheads, prostitutes, drunks and people practicing unsafe sex habits?

No one is suggesting that the Olympics should be "banned" - just that cities should think twice before plunging themselves into 20-30 years of debt and decimating their social services in order to throw a huge corporate party.

Moreover, your characterization of the homeless and destitute is deeply saddening to anyone with a social conscience. The principal cause of these problems is mental illness, not laziness or immorality. Who in Earth would choose to be a "crackhead" or sell their body to survive? These are SYMPTOMS of a larger problem, which needs to be addressed if we are to live in a fair and moral society.

I regret to inform you that your moral posturing is just that: a smokescreen for a rather appalling and pernicious species of ignorance.
JucheThreads: 13
Posts: 356
Joined: Feb 17, 09
Edited by: Juche  Feb 19, 10, 21:35    #16
they should just hold them in Greece (where the games originated) every year and that would end it. also, they should demand every athlete smear him or herself in olive oil like in the old days, and ban corporate advertising, which has long ago turned them into a tiresome to watch corporate wh*refest.
lukaszpoznanskiThreads: 19
Posts: 79
Joined: Mar 24, 08
Edited by: lukaszpoznanski  Feb 19, 10, 21:40    #17
Juche:
they should just hold them in Greece (where the games originated) every year and that would end it.

You mean end Greece right? ;) Alternately, didn't Germany want the games to be held in Berlin each time? I know that Leni Riefenstahl isn't around anymore, but surely they could find a suitable replacement.

On a side note, there was an interesting PR debacle in Vancouver a couple weeks ago, because VANOC made a promotional video for the 2010 Olympics that showed footage from the 1936 Berlin games taken from Riefenstahl's film "Olympia". They digitally obscured all the Nazi salutes, and many people here were pretty offended by the inclusion (and sanitization) of that footage.
bullfrogThreads: 4
Posts: 379
Joined: Apr 23, 09
 Feb 19, 10, 22:07    #18
lukaszpoznanski:
Over 1,000 surgeries have been canceled in Vancouver hospitals to pay for this

I'm not sure I understand how cancelling (note the two 'ls') surgeries help pay Olympic games costs. Can you please elaborate. Thanks
lukaszpoznanskiThreads: 19
Posts: 79
Joined: Mar 24, 08
Edited by: lukaszpoznanski  Feb 19, 10, 22:18    #19
bullfrog:
I'm not sure I understand how cancelling (note the two 'ls') surgeries help pay Olympic games costs. Can you please elaborate. Thanks

Ah, the Grammar Police: To Serve and Correct. :)

Make that 2,450 surgeries throughout Metro Vancouver having been postponed (rather than cancelled). A local breast cancer patient has described this delay as "a nightmare": http://www.bclocalnews.com/news/82307597.html
RonWestThreads: 3
Posts: 165
Joined: Jan 6, 10
 Feb 19, 10, 22:22    #20
quote=Foreigner4]if you see a pattern here, rest assured your eyes do not deceive you: you actually used the very same ill fated attempts at logical debate you've so recently attempted to criticize. Your failure is complete.
Have a nice day:)[/quote]

.......and thus prodded you enough to contribute to the discussion. I'm having a great day, thanks!
bullfrogThreads: 4
Posts: 379
Joined: Apr 23, 09
 Feb 19, 10, 22:27    #21
lukaszpoznanski:
Make that 2,450 surgeries throughout Metro Vancouver having been postponed (rather than cancelled). A local breast cancer patient has described this delay as "a nightmare

This doesn't reply to the question. How does the cancellation of surgeries help fund the Olympics?
RonWestThreads: 3
Posts: 165
Joined: Jan 6, 10
 Feb 19, 10, 22:28    #22
lukaszpoznanski:
I regret to inform you that your moral posturing is just that: a smokescreen for a rather appalling and pernicious species of ignorance.

Not ignorance at all, just a grip on reality. You can stand on a corner and hand out flyers and scream from your podium, good luck changing peoples habits. Habits, by the way, some which have existed sinc the beginning of man.

Furthermore, my wife is a social worker. I'm well aware of the abuse to the system as well as those whom are truly in need and are making the right choices, decisions and efforts to pull themselves up and out of the abyss.
Vancouverite  Mar 6, 10, 19:54    #23
bullfrog:
This doesn't reply to the question. How does the cancellation of surgeries help fund the Olympics?

Our government pays for our health care but with the Olympics, the funds went towards other things rather than to pay for the surgeries that were already scheduled.

I was against the Olympics at first because of the whole craze it would cause. However, it was a nice experience but IMHO, even if we did not host the Olympics...I still don't think we should put funds towards homeless people or drug addicts. I know that some people do CHOOSE this way of life and I do not understand why we should have to pay for their imcompetence. These people do not contribute to society as they clearly do not pay taxes and are social deviants yet they suck up our heath care money and they demand free housing! I think that Canada is a bit too generous sometimes let the strong survive that is the only way they will learn!
Vancouverite  Mar 6, 10, 19:58    #24
^I meant *incompetence*, not imcompetence


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