U.S. Missile Base in Poland----Your thoughts?

I think I answered this here.

Quote Today, 13:33 ¦ My threads #1736


hairball wrote:



NO THEY DID NOT!

That's a totally false statement celinski.

If you would like to post a link to prove me wrong feel free. But I know you won't because it's simply not true!



Poland demands US air defence system
By Jan Cienski in Warsaw and Demetri Sevastopulo in Washington

US officials, who insist the shield does not endanger Moscow’s thousands of missiles, have been wary of similar past requests from Poland, fearing Russia’s reaction.

Mr Klich said Moscow’s problem was not the base itself but “the institutionalised presence of the US in central Europe”, which would mark the final end of Russia’s attempts to exert influence in a region it had historically controlled.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/5b1d9918-96e8-11dc-b2da-0000779fd2ac.html

after all, Poland should take as much as possible from USA, considering that USA is going down soon

Take them brothers everything just don`t take their woman. You don`t need it

I think you can be sure of this..

: )

Sure it is. And mighty Serbia is going to take it's place lol

America is not going down...... We might have lost some politcal power on the international stage, but its nothing we can't fix.... many of our former allies who became strongly anti american (for no logical reason) are now coming around... The Chiraq-Shroeder-Putin alliance against Iraq was mostly responsible for that.... Chiraq is gone and replaced with Sarkozy a Pro American..... Shroeder is gone and replaced with Merkal who is mostly neutral if not slanted Pro American....and Putin will soon be gone, replaced soon with, whatever his name is, you can tell he will be less confrontational then his predecessor...

Now as far as the military front, I see America being the only Superpower for al least another 50 years.... That's the minimun... After that China will join us as the second Superpower..and maybe just maybe the EU if they can get their sh*t together...

and lastly the economic front....Once again America will retain its top spot or second place if taking EU into consideration for another 50 years before China surpasses both of them.. However when it comes to GDP per capital, it will take China another 100 years...

As you can see, America is safe for at the very least for another half century.... only thing that can change this, would be the outbreak of ww3.... which is highly unlikely...

Amen Matt.. and to agree.. China will have a long way to go.. they are just not
as reliable as they once were... lost some credibility with all that rukus from
the dogs and toothpaste.. my dog was affected.. he is still with me. thankfully.

Thank goodness your dog is okey...if my dog got sick, it wouldn't be too good for the chinease... I would Kung Pow their a*s...

Serbia would take it`s place on her own territory, which is currently under NATO occupation


mighty enough to endure untill support and reinforcement arrive

You certainly did-lol!

read: his inability to empathize with any concerns beyond his own.

thats funny considering you dont see the second post to me about the dog food scare
and what happened.. hmmm guess he does have empathy.. just not for you.. :)



kung pow.. lol...

yeah so they dont have much credibility , ive run into * alot * of people in the stores
and I really dont know how much it hurt their trading, but people are checking where
the products are made.. and I am too.. Trust with me is now an issue and in my
book they have to earn that back.. I dont trust them.. I will pay the few extra dollars
to ensure safety..

Russia is just scared, because it is losing control that it once had.
Why shouldn't Poland be entitled to some defense system? Why does Russia have one?
The only issue that Russia could have is that that defense system is sponsored by the Americans, which are their number one rivals. But I say, F**k them.
:)

Thanks Patty for setting that fool straight for me.... kids an idiot...

Foreignor, what nationality are you, might explain your stupidity...

did i ask for any? no. make some sense already instead of just trying for catchy soundbite-esque nonsense.


a foreign one obviously.
well we already what explains your lack of depth on these matters.

Lack of depth..... lol

I know the issue all too well, it is you who is blinded by your dislike for America....

Tell me how having the shield hurts poland.. Let me guess, it makes Russia mad.... that's the stupidest logic..... Let me guess Poland cant make a move so Russia doesn't get mad... if Poland followed your logic, we would not have joined Nato or the EU..

Foreignor want to prove your intelligence list some logical disadvantages and I will list you the advantages..... I can't wait to see what you come up with....

LOL **** the americans??? Re-construct your sentence :)

paszka fu*k the russians, there the ones crying like little school girls...... I don't recall Poland or US crying about Russias anti missle defence....

I did make sense.. alot more then you.. because I actually wrote more then a small
little one liner that tries to break someones spirit.
whats really funny about this.. you dont even know him yet you write a totally false
statement about his personality.. or so you think..are your proud of yourself?




and to top it off.. you picked at random one line from his whole post which is
explaining how he feels and turning it into something else.. and you cant possibly
know whether he has the ability to empathize because youve only got to debate
in a thread which is about the war on terror and or missle base.. both threads
are active /highly tense subjects which can cause people to have tense feelings
about whats going on with it and so how can you judge his personality even for
one minute!!



No Problem matt.. ;)

Actually I am surprised that he said that.. but , maybe it was a off day.

Patty,

It was probably because I don't believe Russia will be becoming a superpower military, or economically.....

Yes foreignor except it, Russia is nothing what it used to be....and for good reason... Its never going to retain its former glory.... the sooner you and your Russian kin accept that, the better the world will be..... Its clear the reason for Russias childish behavior is because its having trouble accepting this reality..

America is always going to be more powerful and important then Russia, and you can take that all the way to the bank....

btw I know why America might not be liked, its just not logical... its based on emotion and paranoia

Also Even though your a dumb*ss, here's some friendly advice for your country....

Instead of Russia spending all there money on military hardware, Russia should focus more on diversifying their economy.. (by working on the development of other industries).. its just a matter of time that oil and gas is going to be replaced as the main energy source... this will obviously cause the money flow to stop.... so use the money wisely, while you have it...

Carol, I brought it up, in the past, rather than have some omnipotent, omniscient government take large portions of our income, then redistribute it to whoever is the best at playing the system (usually, although I'm admittedly a bit cynical about this subject), communities and more specifically, local churches helped their members, through various means, such as collections, tithes, etc etc.
Of course, there are those who believe a government assumed to be all-knowing all-powerful and benevolent should be entrusted with taking care of us and, indeed, knowing what we "need", I am not one of those people.
All this from a comment that government should raise up the people e.g. social security etc....

John P.

First off, you keep making these claims that i'm somehow opposed to all things american. That's simply not true and quite a punk attempt at confusing the issue. Having a mistrust of American Geopolitical Strategy is only that, if you can't identify and isolate that without confusing it with anything else then you're simply not up to the task of discussing this matter in anything more than childish way.


I especially like the part where you request my perspective and then proceed to project your own assumptions on my behalf and then argue against those assumptions. I should simply let you get back to your masturbatory arguements rather than respond but on the off chance you actually learn something from this, i'll forge ahead.

Disadvantage: becomes a source of alienation between Poland and the EU.
Provides an american target within Poland for any possible terrorist threats, even if those threats are unlikely, they are infinitely greater with that stupid base than without.
This base greatly infringes on Polish sovereignty, i've yet to see an interventionist strategy that hasn't come with alterior motives by the intervening party!


Accept imo.
Whether or not Russian leader oppose this doesn't affect my opinion, while that clearly seems to be why you and similarily obtuse folks are in favour of this. I'll write that again so you can soak that up: Russian interestes or protests in no way influence my opinion on this matter.
Why not take your advice for Russian development and apply it here in Polska?
^now that is some paranoia and obsession! Look chappy, you appear to be one of those sorts who somehow equates the economic and military potential of the land where they live as though it translates to his own potential. Wake up son, you're just a guy and what the leaders of your country decide on has absolutely no bearing on anything you actually do. You are in essence, a cheerleader and i have popped your cherry.


actually it's quite obvious he can't when he claims former allies become opposed to u.s. foreign policy for "no logical reason." In fact it's painfully obvious.

that holds absolutely no logic whatsoever, by your argument, the longer books always have more sense than shorter ones. "Break someones spirit(?)" Well i'm sure this wouldn't be the first time you were accused of being a drama queen now would it?

Thanks John I missed that.



I think more important is, why is Russia giving them to "Iran" a clear threat to Poland?

Foreignor wrote

Disadvantage: becomes a source of alienation between Poland and the EU.
Provides an american target within Poland for any possible terrorist threats, even if those threats are unlikely, they are infinitely greater with that stupid base than without.
This base greatly infringes on Polish sovereignty, i've yet to see an interventionist strategy that hasn't come with alterior motives by the intervening party!

Actually EU wants the shield now that they see it will be part of the NATO structure.... some still disagree but not strongly enough to alienate us... argument is wrong...

second agruement, it makes poland a target... poland is already a target for allying with U.S.. anyways that's why we are building the shield, to destroy incoming missles... this is another weak arguement

it infringes on Polish Sovereignty.... first the obvious the specifics have not been agreed upon, so you don't know if Poland won't have control over base.... second poland agrees to host it, when poland was joining the EU this too infringed Polands sovereignty...but the benefits outweight the costs.. once again another weak argument...

and to your question.....

Why not take your advice for Russian development and apply it here in Polska?

Numb nuts Poland is not paying for it....


All your arguments are weak, where's the logic..

Why is it Russia is giving "anti missile to Iran"?

Thank you Carol for making another good point.....

btw Foreignor, I didn't realize a Russian is so concerned with Poland being alienated in EU.

and as to America building it, they can afford it with the size and diversified economy they have...

not every thing is based on logic. we use logic to explain things we have researched
and know something of and its usually something of nature and or man created
but feelings and or opinions arent included in that logic.. because human feelings
change frequently so logic doesnt fit the picture..

example.. a baby crying.. What logic would you use to stop if from crying? its feeling
something,, but logically you cant find the answer.. because it could possibly be so
many things that you have to do to find the one answer.. and the next time the baby
cries.. it will be something totally different.. same with people.. logic doesnt fit
so why you use this as your defense system is beyond me.




yeah,, I heard it once,, it was a weak try too, because I have alot of ability to empathize I get called a drama queen.. oh well then thats what I am... boo hoo.



I agree that Poland should also look into industry /production of goods and marketing
with the US and if the jobs are going to be outsourced at least do it with Poland because Russia is all about control and power and we already have alot of German
run companies here in America. why not Polska.. yes I agree.. we should be doing
more ... tons more.. I trust poland million times more then China.



how does it infringe anything? its going to provide more jobs ( military of course)
and poland will benefit with the money coming in to run it..

Im not saying I like the idea.. but there are benefits as well , if the select few other countries
werent so agressive we wouldnt be even thinking about it.. but This has been discussed before , maybe its been in the works for a long time and just not put into
place.. or acted on.. and no one wants the worst case senario to happen, not at all.

I think what really stepped up the talks was N.Korea if you ask me.. and with good
reasons.. they werent even watching who they were pointing it at..

No this is not the case, in fact the EU / NATO understand Polands need to protect her independence and grow. We must never forget Polands past and loss of freedom. It will be by remembering that Poland will protect what they have.

Matthiuszka my pudding brained foe, enough of the Russia rhetoric, it's a non issue on why this is poor investment of physcial, financial and energy resources. Your pathetic laments on the Russian Bear is matched only by your masturbatory predisposition towards all things american and military. You're sick and you ought to seek help.


so you support making it worse? if anything that's a bloody clear reason for a clear headed leader to cut ties.
source please and thank you.
But this still alienates Poland as the buffer zone target which has a clear American presence. It does have the potential to make Poland the new obvious target, which current member states will be too happy to have but also use this to snub it whenever possible. See the F16 deal that took place about 4 years ago or so, case in point.

Now if you can honestly state that you're always in full 100% support of EU and NATO initiatives then you'd have a hellu arguement and naivety to boot.



au contraire my simple minded foe, the benefits of EU membership have not come to fruition and the costs have yet to be borne, so to use your own statement (funny how you can't even grasp what you type)-

entirely not the point. But it is very probably that the Poles in Poland (not you pretenders) will pay for it in terms of security.
I'll add though, that if Poland gained complete autonomy over this thing then while not being an advocate of military buildup it would be much better than an American presence in Poland.

As stated before, I've yet to see an interventionist (even a disguised one) that hasn't come with alterior motives by the intervening state. If you really believe that American policy makers just woke up one day and thought "ahhh heck les go'n make sure them Poles get some missles to stop Timbuktoo from shootin at'em" then you are a bigger fool than you've led us all to believe.


and Poland is giving it up like matthiuszka did to the starting QB on prom night, only Polish leaders may well stand to play the part of the biggest suckers in Europe-sad.


Not the kind of logic that one could argue or readily quantify BUT putting forth a logical argument based on pros and cons is surely one of those things. If you are incapable of discerning childcare from a political argument ,I emplore you, spend less time with your children as that is certainly in their best interests.
I don't really give a damn for internet feelings, while i won't out and call you a waste of a carbon footprint, similarily, there's no reason to consider another's feelings if this is a topical and not personal debate.
However, I am fascinated....please tell me more how opinions aren't included in that logic i've been referring to, i am truly looking forward to any explanation you can muster for that one!


You write more military jobs like it's a good thing.

But it appears even the pro missle crowd isn't quite sure what they suppport, mattiuszka seems to think it hasn't been decided if in fact it will be american run or Polish. Yet if money comes in to run it then that pretty much tells us who has control over their newest military outpost.
who the bloody hell is "we?" you mean u.s. leaders or polish ones? your loyalties have to lie somewhere when push comes to shove. Besides that Patycakes, your nonpoint brings the best reason not to invest the time, money or energy into this stupid thing-there's no f'n threat, none, zero, zilch, but if you build it, they will come.

So it is beyond you as to why I have, to this point, treated your noise as anything more than a baby crying? Message received, your whole arguement is based on nothing more than irrational, reactionary, infantile whims.
Hey matthiuszka, i like your cheering section!
Foreigner4 the Win!

I have lost track of what side of the argument everyone is on but the above is just funny :)

much obliged to you good sir!
although i've alread bested the beast i fear he is in the process of mixing up a new batch of pistachio enhanced wit. I wonder how long until he figures out the mixing instructions...