Polish immigration in UK

:) it's funny how this thread was started ax a very nice polish lady am like most threads in here it's gone to sh!t

I THINK TO MUCH EMPHASIS IS PUT ON BLAMING MIGRANTS COMING TO UK. LIKE I HAVE SAID BEFORE THE ONLY ONES TO BLAME IS THE GOVERMENT ON HOW THEY HAVE HANDLED TO WHOLE ISSUE OF PEOPLE COMING TO UK FOR WORK. ONE EXAMPLE IS THEY SHOULD HAVE NEVER HANDED OUT ANY BENEFITS TO MIGRANTS UNTIL THEY HAVE CONTRIBUTED AT LEAST TWO YEARS INTO THE TAX SYSTEM, THEN IT WOULD OF CUT DOWN ON THE NUMBER COMING HERE AND ONLY GENUINE WORKERS WOULD BE HERE. NOT ALLOW SCROUNGERS TO GET COUNCIL HOUSES FREE AND LIVE OFF THE STATE. ALSO THEY SHOULD ADOPT AMERICAS POLICY AND ONLY GIVE A 6 MONTH WORK VISA TO KEEP TRACK OF WHOS HERE NOT JUST GUESS. THE LABOUR PARTY NOW REALISE THEY CANT COPE WITH THE INFLUX OF PEOPLE THAT ARE COMING HERE AND THE DEMAND IT,S PUTTING ON THE HEALTH SERVICE /SCHOOLS HOUSING AND ROAD CONGESTION. DUE TO A LOT OF LAZY ARSE BRITISH PEOPLE WHO DONT WANT TO WORK AND LIVE OFF THE DOLE IS THE WHOLE REASON YOU NOW HAVE A MAJORITY OF MIGRANTS HERE DOING THE JOBS, SO IT,S TOO LATE TO ***** AND MOAN AND SAY THERE TAKING ALL THE JOBS AND HOUSES ETC. I DONT LIKE IT AS MUCH AS ANYONE ELSE SEEING THE BRITISH IDENTITY SLOWLY VANISH BUT WHAT CAN WE DO OUR HANDS ARE TIED THE ONLY WAY TO HIT BACK IF YOU REALY FEEL THAT STRONG ABOUT YOUR COUNTRY DONT VOTE FOR THE TWO GOVERMENTS TORIES AND LABOUR. A NATIONAL VOTE SHOULD OF BEEN OFFERED TO THE WHOLE OF BRITISH PUBLIC TO OF HAD THE OPTION TO VOTE EU OR NON EU. CJ

Isn't that how It is now ?

QUOTING GRZEGORZ:IF YOU WATCHED A PROGRAMME SOME WEEKS AGO CALLED DISPATCHES IT SHOWED THAT A SOMALIAN WOMEN CAME TO UK WITH NOTHING COULD HARDLY SPEAK ANY ENGLISH GOT TW0 KIDS AND WAS GETTING PAID £32,000 A YEAR IN BENEFITS AND WAS GIVEN A THREE BEDROMM COUNCIL HOUSE. SO NO THATS NOT HOW IT IS NOW.

She probably was getting that as a "refugee" or something. I think that people from new EU members have to work at least a year before they can claim any benefits except those for kids, which are more like a tax credit than normal benefits.

not to stir the pot here, but


any clue where the lovely isle of britain gained most of its wealth over the years?

How about BP? What oil reserves does britain have that this corporation has become so wealthy? How responsible are british corporations abroad? Do they adhere to environmental regulations and human rights standards of Britain while operating abroad.

You seem like a genuine guy, and I applaud your efforts and focus and wish you luck. I also hope you examine the big picture too.

erm,how about the NORTH SEA fields smarty pants?

and that's it? if that is the sole source of any of bp's fortunes both past and present then i must humbly admit my glaring ignorance and apologize for that. However i still stand by the rest of my querries as honest questions in this matter.

*edited*

yes johnny me old mucker, not sure what britains imperial past has to do with a million Poles arriving here? Or am I forgeting Poland being being invaded by Lord Flashman and claimed for Queen Vicky?

i do look at the enviroment , and i also understand the issues with global warming and i also understand the uk as well as the rest of the E U has played there part too , everyone who drives a motor car , everyone who uses gas , everyone who uses electricity contributes to the demise of the enviroment so lets get off the band wagon of blaming the uk for all the worlds wrongs , what about the many achievments the uk is responsible for ie , the motor car , the aeroplane , the tv , the lightbulb , the nuclear weapons , ships , tanks , neutron bomb , the manufacture of many wonderful drugs like penicillin , drugs to treat asthma , heart disease , and many many more things to be proud of , if people dislike the uk so much ask yourself one question HONESTLY ! why do they flock here in their millions , if they don,t like it LEAVE simple really , they have a choice , but please don,t make youre way into my country and whinge like little faggits about how bad it is , GO HOME EASY AS THAT !!!!!!!!!!!

completely agree but i think it should be 5 years .

no i'm sorry if you interpreted my challenge that way. What i meant to imply is that, the wealth of the nation you live in was not got by means completely devoid of exploitation of other nations and peoples. While you may have not contributed to this, you and yours certainly benefit from it. I could wonder how concerned you really are about the ethicacy of how the money that goes into the british economy is got? How concerned are you about the ethicacy and responsibility of british national corporations abroad?

I'm not saying you yourself are contributing to any unethical (read exploitation) abroad (except if you support the corporations responsible for it with your pocket book-one reason not to shop at ASDA), but if you're not equally dismayed and ready to do something about that then your position comes off as more than a little disingenuous.


well unless you're one of the people who actually played a key role in developing those things or contributed in some mighty way to the history of those events or are doing so now in some way then i'd say this is non-point and you really have nothing to be proud of as you've in no way influenced these things. agree to disagree.


well ask yourself why the english (in the past mind you, and not you personally) went abroad to lands where they considered the people "inferior?" It's the money stupid.


i whole heartedly agree with your sentiments but i'm not sure if whinging like a "really no need for that" on a message board will really solve your problem.


hmmm i looked it up and here's my source:
bp.com/multipleimagesection.do?categoryId=23&contentId=7017765

Bp in fact operates far beyond only the north sea, i retract my apology and stand by my initial querry but remain ready to admit any good points should you make one. But it does appear you need to flesh out your arguement more for me to do this.

- You mean it is not a healthy situation that over hundreds of years countless Brits have been leaving Britain for the New World, Australia, New Zealand, etc.?

:)
PS. And yourself, if I'm not mistaken, also are living abroad, aren't you? ;)


- Well, zeze, you're a South American Jew yourself (or so you say). Then if you're against emigration so much, what the hell are you doing in Poland?

:)

how is the post you're quoting in any way advocating against emigration? recognizing the sadness of a no win situation isn't an arguement against anything is it? I am puzzled by this train of logic you're attempting to run here.

- Have I quoted you out of context? Did you actually mean that it is a 'healthy situation' when many people leave their native country to earn their bread in another one?

Take it easy, brother. I'm not here to hurt you in any way. And it's certainly healthy to ask questions, even the most puzzling ones. We're all just human and so we all err - myself included. Please point to me any inconsistencies in my train of logic every time you spot them. Will be grateful for this. Greetings.

:)

hmmm, i think i'm taking it pretty easy but i'l check my pulse rpr-56bpm. ok i am officially taking it easy.
No you haven't quoted me out of context at all, in fact i didn't even respond in regards to my being quoted specifically.

I was just curious how you tied his response to my quote into an anti-migration position.

So, really, i am puzzled, please explain how you connected the two. Maybe there were some other posts you're referring to, otherwise i'm doubting my own ability to read the arguement here.

- He praised your 'not healthy situation' quote, and before that, in other posts, he postulated that all (?) Poles working in UK should return to Poland.

No hard feelings, man.
:)

answer me a couple of questions , do you reside in the uk ? if so do you use the state funding system , or you one of the few that has actually come to this country to work ? if so we have no argument what so ever with each other , my comments are towards the lazy gits that come here and play the system , please please please go home ! save us all a headache , but people who come from abroad and actually contribute by working and paying taxes , well you got my full support .

Do you think lazy gits will come to this forum and read your post, re-think their lives and come back to Poland?

i did, i paid my taxes and never claimed any back.

You may not have an arguement with me but until you address my points, then it appears you want nothing more than to live in a fantasy land of no taking without giving and profiting without sharing.

A good chunk of the wealth your country generates is got off exploiting resources abroad. you're fine with the money pouring in but not ok when people from abroad want to follow the money trail.

I actually agree with how you feel (happening in other ways to where i'm from) but i'd be hard pressed to defend your position without any concessions to the mitigating factors affecting the situation.


i see, well that arguement could be turned around easy enough: all non pole immigrants should go back to where they come, shouldn't they? i wonder how that would grab people.

cheers for that mate.

well just to quote england also brought a great deal of wealth to those lands including the usa , cotton trade and plantations , remember it was the africans selling africans , if this did not happen then there would of been a very small percentage of africans actually caught up in that terrible trade , as did the middle east also exploit the slave trade many hundreds of years before the british even set sail to foreign shores , lets see how the middle east fares without the western economy when again the uk scientists come up with inventions that no longer need to rely on fossil fuels , to run our motor cars and heat our homes , solar energy , wind farms , and our own oil from the north sea will always see a big percentage of the uk self sufficient , when did the uk ever ask any other european country for help ? we havent , who is always first to come running to the uk and the usa when things go wrong namely invasions or some sort of disaster , france , bosnia , serbia , east west germany , poland , rwanda , zimbabwe , take africa for instance who,s drugs do they rely on most to wipe out the aids epidemic , the starving , the disabled , who are the two main prominent countries always in the limelight on helping out with aid for africa , india , pakistan , always the same two countries USA & the UK , always seem to be ahead of the field , please don,t preach to me mate if it was,nt for these two great countries the rest of europe would be under german rule and the 3 big nations namely africa , india , pakistan would be in complete turmoil ,, so please please please go away do a crash course on history in the past 200 years and then come back with a constructive argument , nuff said .

the beginning of the end of logic or reason even casting a dim light on your rant.


ahh yes a crash course on history, well by the looks of your post that's exactly what you've done. there's nothing to debate as it's clear your grasp of the world is very very limited and you're just not going to see the light even when shown to you.

but let's look at economics kiddo, how much do british firms rake in based on the expoitation of the 3rd world and developing world resources both natural and human? Now how much does the UK give in aid? Do you really think those 2 numbers are anywhere near eachother?


well that tells us a lot about where you get your news doesn't it? seems like you come from the land that can do no wrong.


Always with the most aggressive policies abroad-coincidence?


Well if this wouldn't have happened your magic crystal ball of alternate universes, oh please! Right mate, that's where you and your arguement lost any and all credibility. Fair enough, you shot from the hip, you missed your mark, better luck next time.

LOL!

finally someone with a sense of humour AND good arguments.
thumbs up!

- I have never hit upon even one such case amongst the hundreds of Poles I've met in both England and Ireland. Are you sure you are posting on the right forum, mate? Shouldn't you rather inquire with some Third World forum?


- Precisely my point.
:)

okay... i'm gonna pack my bags then... ;)

how can someone come to the uk and play the system??
when i first came here (3.5 years ago) it was made clear that i can stay as long as i want if i am working and earning my own money... state benfits? not for (EU?)foreigners if they haven't been working for at least a year.

if i lost my job and could not have financed myself i would have had to leave the country after 3 months...

did they change that in the meantime or are there different rules for germans and poles??

yeah that's what i wasn't quite sure about either, but as i had no intentions of not working or staying beyond a year i just didn't investigate that. I hear officially the system is hard to abuse, but then i hear all these stories come out of the wood work. I ask myself,"Foreigner4, what are the odds all these people just making up bs stories?"

The odds can't be that great can they? However if it's a gov't run system with gov't workers then there's very good chances that the system is being abused. But to what extent i can only guess, and are those abuses even a drop in the bucket compared to what large corps don't pay or escape paying? anyway, i'm probably taking this in a direction that the thread starter didn't intend. But your post does shed light on the situation as regards my own understanding.

*edited for p!ss poor wording*

don,t talk in riddles foreigner , you,ll lose the crux of my initial point , believe in one thing i am considerably richer than yew lol !!!!!

what the light according to foreigner , of course i won,t i,m english there fore i,m right you silly person , i have an extensive knowledge of the past as you know we english have a history unlike most other euro countries ,

how can we brits exploit the third world when you have polish mafia selling there own people into prostitution , indians selling there children to workhouses , africans selling there children to arab states , oh and not to mention pakistani,s selling there children to become boy soldiers as did the africans , brazillian kids living in underground sewers because their parents breed like rats and cannot provide as do africans , russians would sell there own mother for a bottle of decent vodka , french are cowards , germans well we kicked there arse nuff said their eh , the only other countries in the eu finland , sweden , arethe others who like the uk don,t mind watching all these other nations sell each other down the river .

which, as you prove in your next post, wasn't thanx to people like you...


apart from germany being apparently one of the countries in europe without history, is "kicking their arse" (i'd like to know when that happened) the only thing that makes you superior???

thank goodness you are not representative for british people...

actually i am wondering how stupid you really are...


okay... now i know... ;)

To help you along, when i write something that i'm not confident you'll grasp, i've decided to add the meaning in bold in parenthesis (the moon shaped things this is inbetween), ok? sometimes, i might even put in a smile face (:)) to show you i mean no harm.


believe in this, if wealth were the only measure of one's worth, it would be easier for any man to simply walk up to you, cut your throat and take what is yours than to work at all. obviously you nor i advocate such a reality, so it's clear that you perceived (that means understood) you were outclassed, so you took another swing at it and tried to console your ego with some chest thumping in the form of wallet touting (showing off:)

And i congratulate you on your efforts, consider this a counteroffensive (that means i'm swinging back) more effective and on the money than your attempt.

what i'm curious about though is how it is that you're so wealthy, yet you frequent with so many people living off the system. Hmmm, what sympathy i had for your plight has vanished as it is evident (which means clear ok:) you are becoming dimmer by the post or a liar (and not a very good one at that).


...the rest of your infantile post to contend with?
well it appears that exploitation can be made legal and therefore "acceptable" with a few pen strokes (and undoubtedly, money changing hands, but i freely admit this to be my assumption). The existence of street level crime you detailed doesn't invalidate that corporate crime exists and excasberates the social disorder that exists.

Legality doesn't equal ethicacy, uniforms don't equal peace, and clean suits don't make a crime less filthy.

ok, dismissed (you can go back) to your money game where you get to add up numbers and feel good about yourself, enjoy a biscuit too. it's on me ok?


interesting falkster; i've gathered his whole spiel seems to be that, because some fellows who were english had some success in various areas (armed conflict being one of them) at some point in history, that somehow validates his own place in his mind. very very interesting.

As a british citizen and very proud to be british might i add , my wealth has been aquired through hard work and no ones self respect was crushed along the way , like i mentioned earlier i started with pennies and now through sheer determination i have found my niche , and its a good place to be , try it instead of blaming all these big financiers and corporations , who obviously generate wealth , & that is the aim of all organisations is it not ? or who wants to place a friendly wager with me by naming me 5 non profit making humanitarean organisations whose management & directors work for £00.00 amount of pounds and take no monies what so ever from the money generated , by all you giving souls out their , if you work and not for yourself , you must work for a wage , if the companies cannot make profits where do you get paid ? no rocket science in this .

The only people who benefit from this large-scale economic migration are unscrupulous employers who pay Scrooge wages to workers who are prepared to tolerate poor pay and squalid, overcrowded or unsuitable conditions, so that they can either accrue meagre savings or send sterling abroad to their families. The native taxpayers will never recoup their losses through paying benefits to British workers denied a living wage, adequate housing, education or health provision because of the needs/demands of migrant workers and their indigent families. We should boot them out, close our borders and re-establish a fairer Britain for the hard-pressed British now! Excuses from this lackadaisical government will no longer wash, and the Tories actively connive to keep this dire situation going to benefit their big business pals. Unless you want more of the same, better start thinking the unthinkable.