Why are Polish Americans mocked in the American media?

paczemoj 1 | 3

30 Sep 2010 #91

I think it's also important to remember a bit of history. Until the 20th century, Slavs (including Poles) and other people from east of Germany, and southern Europeans (Italians, Greeks, etc.) were considered a kind of "second category" of "white" person in America-or sometimes not "white" at all.

From page 76 of Whiteness of a Different Color: European Immigrants and the Alchemy of Race:

The ascendent view among native-born Americans in the 1890s, even Anglo-Saxons and Others as John Wigmore was writing, was not that Japanese immigrants held "as good a claim to the color 'white' as the Southern European and Semitic peoples," and therefore ought to be granted citizenship, but rather, that Southern European, Semitic, and Slavic immigrants held as poor a claim to the color "white" as the Japanese, and therefore ought to be turned away at once. The racialism of this prevailing view of the newer European immigrants, its basis in republican logic, and its relationship to racialized assessments of Asians (...)

The Immigration Act of 1924 severely limited Polish (and other undesirable) immigration and anti-Slavic stereotypes were prevalent (much, much more than now) in American society until the interwar period. Most were variations of stereotypes that attach to any new and different group: dumb (can't speak English), smelly (eat different foods), shady (stick together), dirty (poor), etc. Some were new. After 1917, Slavs carried the stigma of Bolshevism and of trying to undermine moral order and good government. Most people couldn't care or didn't know how to distinguish between Slavs. And it's true that Poles did participate in labour unions. Plus, Poles were Catholics and America has a vast history of anti-Catholic sentiment. The KKK disliked: Blacks, Jews and Catholics. Even when Kennedy was elected, there were grumblings about a "Papist" plot to take over America. Remember that America was created by people who considered themselves religious outcasts (and partly were). They disliked the Catholic Church, to say the least.

As for jokes today, I think they come from that "tradition" but are also different in that though they may be offensive and in poor taste, they are not treated as serious statements of fact nor are they malicious. They bug me sometimes and I agree that political correctness dictates who we may or may not make fun of and jokes about, but I think they're also a sign of how normal it's become to be Polish-American. The lack of Black jokes (except by Black comedians) and the flow of heroic or "good" Black characters is, I think, a symptom of American still having trouble with its slave-owning and segregationist past. It's a strange way of trying to "correct" a historical "wrong".

Ironside 53 | 12,424

30 Sep 2010 #92

This whole thread is a bunch nonsence, supposedly created by some guest,,,ya, right!

Yeah, all over again, how many times they can go about the Pollack jokes/? You say this is over and not a media mainstream, and its good enough for me!

Ah ?those guest......!

Bzibzioh

30 Sep 2010 #93

As for jokes today, I think they come from that "tradition" but are also different in that though they may be offensive and in poor taste, they are not treated as serious statements of fact nor are they malicious.

The way Poles are presented is more lazy stereotyping than maliciousness.

The lack of Black jokes (except by Black comedians) and the flow of heroic or "good" Black characters is, I think, a symptom of American still having trouble with its slave-owning and segregationist past. It's a strange way of trying to "correct" a historical "wrong".

They are definitely overcompensating for the past wrongs.

richasis 1 | 418

30 Sep 2010 #94

You're just leeches looking for money anyway.

What? From the greatest debtor nation in history who lives off China's bank?
Besides, 'money' is America's only way to 'win friends and influence enemies'.

This, from the nation who brought us TARP (AKA 'The Jobless Recovery Act').

Who, in most cases are just as racist as any American ever dreamed of being.

Any? Statistically, most racist Americans are her beloved minorities.

Why don't you talk about what your fellow Europeans say about you?

You mean, outside of the fact they are usually correct?

I never let my being 'American' keep me blind to her in-your-face realities.

trener zolwia 1 | 939

30 Sep 2010 #95

I think it's also important to remember a bit of history.

Good stuff, man.

Most of us have indeed moved on but there is a cottage industry that is determined to keep black historical grievance alive for their benefit today. The Left treats blacks like retarded children who ever need protection and eternal assistance. Another part of what they do is keep the past alive in the public psyche via pop culture entertainment and continual scolding about our racial past so that they can then implement their misplaced black sympathy into policy. It's dirty and divisive group politics enforced with PC is what it is.

Pinching Pete - | 554

30 Sep 2010 #96

never let my being 'American' keep me blind to her in-your-face realities

Right.. and you're leaving the US when? You leave you'll be back in 2 years tops. Cut the crap.

richasis 1 | 418

30 Sep 2010 #97

Most of us have indeed moved on but there is a cottage industry that is determined to keep black historical grievance alive for their benefit today.

It thinks it's more than just a 'cottage industry' - what's more, I think it's all contrived.

Right.. and you're leaving the US when? You leave you'll be back in 2 years tops. Cut the crap.

Nah, I've had enough of teaching grade school curriculum to college freshmen.

Chicago Pollock 7 | 503

30 Sep 2010 #98

The Big Lie on Polish Forum is that Poles in America are subjected to public bashing. A complete lie. Nothing is further from the truth. They were never subject to public bashing. The TV series (1970's) he keeps referring to was "All in the Family" about a bigot who's daughter was married to an American of Polish descent and the theme of the show was that the son-in-law would argue with his father-in-law about being bigoted. The show actually showed Poles to be progressive and open minded.

ZIMMY 6 | 1,601

30 Sep 2010 #99

youtube.com/watch?v=ykuGCT2uixk

Bzibzioh

30 Sep 2010 #100

The show actually showed Poles to be progressive and open minded.

So how come many Americans today indicate this show as the source of all they know about Polish people and all the jokes about them?

ZIMMY
You know that those "Polish sayings" of Banacek have nothing to do with ... Polish sayings or proverbs at all. Not even one of them. So why do you keep quoting it?

Chicago Pollock 7 | 503

30 Sep 2010 #101

So how come many Americans today indicate this show as the source of all they know about Polish people and all the jokes about them?

answers.com/topic/all-in-the-family

Bzibzioh

30 Sep 2010 #102

Chicago Pollock
So a lot of people must have missed the sarcasm because they bought those jokes as truth.

Chicago Pollock 7 | 503

30 Sep 2010 #103

Here's the description of the character, hardly derogatory:

Rob Reiner as Michael Stivic. Gloria's Polish-American hippie husband was part of the counterculture of the 1960s. He constantly sparred with Archie (in the original pilot, the character 'Michael' was Irish-American). Michael's character was, in many ways, as stubborn as Archie, even though his moral views were generally presented as being more ethical and his logic somewhat more sound. For his bullheadedness, Stivic was sometimes criticized for being an elitist. While Archie demonstrated the lion's share of the hypocrisy, Michael had, on occasion, shown his own. As discussed in All in the Family retrospectives...

Bzibzioh

30 Sep 2010 #104

Chicago Pollock
I know what you mean, but still a lot of people I talked to said that they never personally meet a Pole before, and all they know it's from this show, all the jokes and innuendos. And they are still laughing at those jokes. Why shouldn't they? American TV never had a positive Polish role model, only those idiotic old tired prejudices. Check my recent example I posted earlier in this thread.

richasis 1 | 418

30 Sep 2010 #105

^ "Sticks and stones may break my bones, and you are one dumb Polack" - Archie Bunker to Mike Stivic.

Of course the ultimate irony is that, when it all is said and done, the stupid libtard had it coming to him :)

Chicago Pollock 7 | 503

30 Sep 2010 #106

I know what you mean

^ "Sticks and stones may break my bones, and you are one dumb Polack" - Archie Bunker to Mike Stivic.

you can still get the show on cable or dvd's. It was a popular show. I'm old enough to remember it. All I can is...see it for yourself. YOU BE THE JUDGE.

richasis 1 | 418

30 Sep 2010 #107

All I can is...see it for yourself. YOU BE THE JUDGE.

I hate that show so much, I have the first five seasons on DVD :)

guesswho 4 | 1,278

30 Sep 2010 #108

I couldn't agree more with what you've said here (I was born and raised in 'America'). When I leave for Poland, I may not return here - not even to visit.

Go to your promised land man, I was there with my parents and couldn't wait to leave it behind me. You got to have a really strong connection to this country to love it. Then again, I guess, it's a matter of taste too.

richasis 1 | 418

30 Sep 2010 #109

Go to your promised land man, I was there with my parents and couldn't wait to leave it behind me.

I have friends who moved to Poland only to return to the States after a few years.
As for me, I am under no illusions - living in Poland will in no way be like 'visiting' it.

I do know one thing: there are Poles who would gladly take my spot here in the US.